Cacophony Forums
Unofficial Mackie User Forums => DL1608/DL806/DL32R/ProDX Mixers => Topic started by: Aqntbghd on October 25, 2016, 10:47:10 AM
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Hello,
I've been looking at options to convert recording done by the DL32R from the set of multi-channels wav files into a set of one file per channel. I also wanted to have a batch processing system so i can convert everything in one go and not involve complex drag'n'drop or risk of damaging the file. I've looked at doing that using the terminal and an wonderful tool called Sox. This tool is available on Linux machines and on Mac if you install MacPorts or HomeBrew. Once i had that i did some testing and managed to make a small shell script that will convert all files as expected. I'm attaching the script to this post, in hope it might help some people here.
To run it, just open Terminal, copy the script at the root of your DL32R disk drive (probably /Volumes/Untitled1) then cd into that folder and run ./convert-dl32R.sh you will have the file appearing in each recording folder named whatever_channel_14.wav Also ensure you have some spare space on the drive (at least 2 times the used space, as the script needs to some space to first merge the files in one HUGE file and then demux it)
Cheers,
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in my humble opinion,
The Mackie DL32R should send individual mono wav files to the drive for multitrack recording,
not this extremely useless multichannel wav format that requires hours of tedious stitching and converting.
I would love to connect a drive and not have to use my Mac laptop and Digital Performer to make a multi-track recording, but I don't see that ever changing. :(
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I completely agree with you : this is a major feature gap for this product. and some others have clearly understood that, look at the presonus integration between capture and studio-one and you'll see how far it can go (the recorded project has the plugins configuration os that when you open it in your DAW you have the plugins set as your channels). However i think we can make it better for Mackie. As an example, it is obvious that the D32R is actually running an embedded linux inside, how about they get the Sox library and code that change to write multiple files instead of one big multichannel one ? even if it is a write-only format, it could make it easier for a lot of us. I was also considering making this script into a small raspberry-Pi machine, so i could plug a hard drive to it and it would convert for me with no interaction. there are plenty of possible tricks there :)
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If you look at the MF4 manual legal disclaimer you will find that the recording/streaming software is Archwave's. I don't think Mackie has the expertise in house to do much with it. I have not found a disassembly of a DL32 but it most likely has the Archwave hardware to accomplish this.
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OEM ARCHWAVE UREC2500 MODULE for DL32r
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i'm ok that they integrate hardware and software from other providers (and it is well known that most audio companies are more marketing than dev these days). but even so, then might just need to pass on the requirement from their customers onto their suppliers of OEM. If it matters for the customer it matters for Mackie. Otherwise i'll end up buying a Presonus next time i need to update my gear ;)
PS: has anyone done a reverse-engineering of the dl32R ? i've spotted some linux filesystem for the update files in the masterfader app...
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It's based on an old version of uClinux.
http://www.uclinux.org/index.html
Or more specifically for the AD Blackfin CPU.
https://docs.blackfin.uclinux.org/doku.php?id=uclinux_on_blackfin
Haven't looked lately if they ever migrated to Buildroot.
https://buildroot.org/
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It would be awesome to have the option to have a single wav per channel. Wow, my life would become a lot less complicated as I record over 100 shows a year, bust them down into songs and that means a rough mix, and exporting from audacity, then opening the next multitrack file, setting the mixer settings to the same as for the last file's songs... the stitch it together so there are no gaps.
Sigh
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John,
I highly suggest using a laptop and record to it using your favorite DAW.
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John,
I highly suggest using a laptop and record to it using your favorite DAW.
That's additional space, something else to setup and access to start recording with
I used to record with a presonus fire studio and additional Adat da with a computer.
Part of the reason I went with the mackie was to eliminate that.
The mackie is so close to perfect
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If space is a issue and you have a current iPad that can dual task try Audia or some of the other DAW's for recording. Most record individual channels. You can probably do all you are currently doing in them.
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If space is a issue and you have a current iPad that can dual task try Audia or some of the other DAW's for recording. Most record individual channels.
I get this. I've done thousands of shows where I have recorded the entire show using analog and daw. It's fine it works okay. It's just more setup, and something else for people to have to remember to do, with room for errors.
But, the mackie records perfectly. The recordings direct to disk are fantastic.
If the developers would implement an option to record individual tracks to individual wav files, it would be a huge benefit to not just me. I know more than a handful of people who upon finding out that mackie only did multiway format into small chunks (where they had to stitch them together because songs are split in the middle as it creates a new file) they went another way. Lost revenue for mackie, and the image thing too as these people whine about it loudly.
I deal with it because of the convenient ability to record via the master Fader. I don't have to step over to another computer to start it, don't have to worry about my MacBook crapping out again right before a show. I just start the recording.
My punishment is dealing with it in post =)
IF mackie would implement the option to do individual tracks, it would enable every small band to record in the normal way, send the wavs to someone else to mix and master. As it stands, no studio is going to take 2 hours of live music in multiwav and stitch it together, then mix it. No pro studio... maybe home studios.
Kenny Chesney's sound guy, what's his name? Sidephil? Uses a dl32r for their backstage jams... working up new music. Ask him how valuable it would be to record a session and then take the drive and just import the whole session in individual wavs to be able to quickly isolate one song they want a scratch demo of....
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I'm confused - is there not a simple program available to do that conversion?
My video cameras record .mts files in 2GB "chunks" and I found a simple program that stitches them together into a single file. I can then run a simple a conversion to MP4, with or without normalizing the audio and reducing the resolution (I usually go right to 720P30 - my cameras only record 1080i60).
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I'm confused - is there not a simple program available to do that conversion?
My video cameras record .mts files in 2GB "chunks" and I found a simple program that stitches them together into a single file. I can then run a simple a conversion to MP4, with or without normalizing the audio and reducing the resolution (I usually go right to 720P30 - my cameras only record 1080i60).
Maybe someone can give us a simple process to do the following.
Convert several hours of dl32r recordings which are multitrack wav files, into individual channels, of one single wav with no gap in them.
I record from 18 to 26 channels at each show.
If I had 18 to 26 wav files that were gapless, that would rock.
My current process is using audacity, I load the first saved file, do my mix, then save each song to two track stereo.
Ultimately one song will be split to the next file.
So, write down the level of each channel, and the l/r pan
Load the next file, set the mix to what I wrote down, save the half song, then any other songs.
Load the first half of a split two track song and add the 2nd, remove the gap.
Adding effects, eq'ing etc, this way is a nightmare.
I can't use protocols because I have lost my ilok dongle and don't have a backup.
I have 30-50 songs on each of these gigs.
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https://www.sounddevices.com/products/accessories/software/wave-agent ?
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Can someone post a link to a couple of these files that need to be joined and then split? I'd like to see if I can do it with ffmpeg and a simple batch file...
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Can someone post a link to a couple of these files that need to be joined and then split? I'd like to see if I can do it with ffmpeg and a simple batch file...
Sure, let me get caught up in the morning and I will see about uploading and sharing a couple with you
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Can someone post a link to a couple of these files that need to be joined and then split? I'd like to see if I can do it with ffmpeg and a simple batch file...
Sure, let me get caught up in the morning and I will see about uploading and sharing a couple with you
The format of the WAV file is quite simple, it wouldn't be hard to write a utility that just does what's needed. I guess Mackie deemed it unnecessary?
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In pro tools you import them to cliplist , click on them (so they expand) and pull them in with shuffle engaged and they line up nicely
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Can someone post a link to a couple of these files that need to be joined and then split? I'd like to see if I can do it with ffmpeg and a simple batch file...
Look at the first post in this thread, there is attached a script that does exactly this with Sox :) replace the program invocation with ffmpeg if you prefer :)
The format of the WAV file is quite simple, it wouldn't be hard to write a utility that just does what's needed. I guess Mackie deemed it unnecessary?
There is a trick here : the Wav format is limited to 4GB (32 bits) in size, so you need to use an intermediary format that support larger files when stitching everything together as the overall result tend to go over that boundary. this is fixed by the w64 format as an example.
If somebody thinks there might be a business for this i'd be happy to build and sell a small device that when connected to a make recorded hard-drive will convert the files on it, but you'll have to cover my dev and hardware costs ;) however this could make the transformation just a matter of time : plug and wait for the green light.
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Look at the first post in this thread, there is attached a script that does exactly this with Sox :) replace the program invocation with ffmpeg if you prefer :)
Can that script run under MacOS and Windows? Linux doesn't "work" for 99%+ of the folks looking to do this :(
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Once I have a couple of these !@#$ WAV files I'll try to port that script to Windows. SOX is available for Windows:
https://sourceforge.net/projects/sox/
:)
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Once I have a couple of these !@#$ WAV files I'll try to port that script to Windows. SOX is available for Windows:
https://sourceforge.net/projects/sox/
Powershell is not that complicated, it should work however i'm not bothered doing it as it is not my platform of choice... for some beers and/or money i could though :)
Look at the first post in this thread, there is attached a script that does exactly this with Sox :) replace the program invocation with ffmpeg if you prefer :)
Can that script run under MacOS and Windows? Linux doesn't "work" for 99%+ of the folks looking to do this :(
Yes i wrote the script under macOS and it runs fine on there. Linux works too. For windows you could also play with CyGWin to get a bash and run this script :)
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Once I have a couple of these !@#$ WAV files I'll try to port that script to Windows. SOX is available for Windows:
https://sourceforge.net/projects/sox/
:)
Message me your email addy and I will send you a link to a google drive folder with a couple 2 gig multichannel wav files from a show on Saturday.
The following channels / tracks are used:
01 Chip Vocals
02 John Vocals
03 Richard Vocals
04 Tony Vocals
05 Megan Vocals
06 Carlos Vocals
07 Sampler
08 - not used
09 Bass drum
10 Snare
11 Tom 1 (not used this gig)
12 Tom 2
13 Tom 3 (not used this gig)
14 Floor Tom
15 Overhead
16 Overhead
17 Bass
18 Guitar
19 Key 1
20 Key 2
21 Sax wireless
22 Trumpet
23 Sax
With 23 channels being recorded, that means about 10 minutes per file. Generally close to 2-3 songs, and almost always, splitting one or two of them in two.
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BTW early on someone was using "RME WAV File Batch Processor":
https://www.rme-audio.de/en/downloads/driver/midi_remote.php
Have you tried that?
http://cacophony.aspinock.com/index.php?topic=883.0
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The RME utility seems to work fine but is particular about input filenames - The must be:
UFX01_00.wav
UFX01_01.wav
etc.
The two digits after UFX can be any two digits but obviously the same for all the files in the set.
This utility can generate a HUGE single multichannel WAV file choosing the "Multichannel" option - supposedly some DAWs can directly import that.
It also has a "1-Channel Files" option to generate all separate mono WAV files.
Read the"help" and give it a try and let me know if it works for all y'all :) .
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I was able to use the RME utility to join two 2GB 23 channel "chunks" into a single 4GB file and load that into Audacity. It took forever to load but seems to play without any glitch at the half-way point 8) .
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I was able to use the RME utility to join two 2GB 23 channel "chunks" into a single 4GB file and load that into Audacity. It took forever to load but seems to play without any glitch at the half-way point 8) .
I will give it a shot when I get some time today and let you know my results!
Joining the multi-wav files together without gaps for a full set would make my life so much easier, at least I could manipulate them better in audacity.
But then if it can join them all together, and split it into individual wavs, I could also use another DAW I like, which is Audition (Adobe).
All of this would be a moot point if Mackie would just allow the creation of individual wavs for each track as an option...
Or if everyone had ProTools (or at least if I had my iLok back, then I could do it. haha)
Thanks, will let you know...
John
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For those who wonder why Mackie is writing multitrack WAV files instead of splitted ones,
I think it is simply because the stress on the HD is much lower.
Only one file has to be written at a time.
When you record on a rotating disk, maximum 32 separated files have to be written.
That means the writing head has to jump around a lot.
2,5" disks may have trouble doing this especially when low frequencies are around.
I'm very happy with the recording reliability of my DL32R.
And importing multitrack WAV files in Logic is simply drag & drop. Logic does the splitting. :)
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The help file for the RME utility discusses why they use the multitrack WAV format for their own recording interface. Basically it would take a superfast drive and lots of RAM and processing power to do individual WAV files in realtime. Mackie chose to support recording to normal drives and to not inflate the cost of their hardware. In any case the RME utility is super easy to use :) .
If I was youse guys I'd be beating on my DAW maker to upgrade their out-of-date software to support this great format :) .
A suggestion - rather that make a hugearse file of the whole set (or night :eek:) that will take forever to import into your DAW the RME utility allows you to specify a start and end "chunk" number so you'd be better off figuring out which two chunks your song is in and just joining those two 8) .
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Okay, I'm back to having a little time to play with the recordings....
Let's say I use SoX and want to join two multi-wav files together - how does one stitch them together... I tried the sox -m firstfilename secondfilename newfilename thing, and it just created a new file the same size as one of the specified files but did not add the first to the second.
If sox isn't the tool, what tool is available to me? I know, we talked about this, but now I've got actual time to play with it =)
Thanks!
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RME has a bach prossersor software:
Fireface UFX - RME Multichannel WAV File Batch Processor
That can do it it has some naming rules though , so the file names has to follow a specific pattern
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RME has a bach prossersor software:
Fireface UFX - RME Multichannel WAV File Batch Processor
That can do it it has some naming rules though , so the file names has to follow a specific pattern
I cannot figure out how to make it add a 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc multi track wav to the first one and save it as a new file.
For instance, last night I recorded 25 channels with the DL32R. Each set is about an hour, and the recording was started at the beginning of each set, so I have half a dozen of these multitrack wav files and I would like to combine them into one big multitrack.
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Did you read post #25 in this thread? :P
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Did you read post #25 in this thread? :P
The RME utility seems to work fine but is particular about input filenames - The must be:
UFX01_00.wav
UFX01_01.wav
etc.
The two digits after UFX can be any two digits but obviously the same for all the files in the set.
This utility can generate a HUGE single multichannel WAV file choosing the "Multichannel" option - supposedly some DAWs can directly import that.
It also has a "1-Channel Files" option to generate all separate mono WAV files.
That One? I just must be dense... let's say I have a folder with 7 files (a whole set) from the dl32r.
I want to join them all together into one file.
Can you talk me through that whole process with this tool please? I read the help file, it didn't help me.
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OMG, I *AM* dense....
You quite literally meant that the filenames had to be changed to their format. ugh.
Then you select the first file in the folder named that, and edit the output name and type.
It automatically selects the last file (highest number)... And hit start.
This is sure not an elegant process =(
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John, you are correct,
it is pathetic
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John, you are correct,
it is pathetic
It's just a lot of work when other mixers and stand-alone recorders give me individual tracks straight to a USB hard drive (or flash drive even). It's so easy on other devices to just hit "record" and let it record a set, or heck, I've done entire 2-3 hour events and had 18-24 individual tracks right off the preamps and it imports directly into any DAW without any stitching multitracks together, no fuss, no muss.
Seems like they could just have an option, so whoever wants multitrack.wavs can have that, and flip a config item switch and boom, individual wavs that are not broken up every x minutes.
That is my only real complaint about the DL32R, everything else works pretty darn great on it.
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I agree :)
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The help file for the RME utility does a great job explaining why segmented multichannel wav files are necessary.
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I have no problem understanding multichannnel wav files.
I have no time for all the crap that is involved in transferring, converting, editing those files.
It is just sad that this format is used with the DL32R.