Cacophony Forums
Unofficial Mackie User Forums => DL1608/DL806/DL32R/ProDX Mixers => Topic started by: tmn126 on December 15, 2014, 11:25:04 PM
-
Cheers,
-
Installed it on a freshly restored iPad 2 (30 pin) still has the lags. :(
-
Installed it on a freshly restored iPad 2 (30 pin) still has the lags. :(
:facepalm: Wonderful. I hope it works better for you? 8)
Later today....
Thought I would try the update on my older iPad 2. First thing right out of the gate I noticed, the faders are slower to respond than in 2.1.1. I know since I was using the DL for most of the day today at the schools rehearsals, on 2.1.1 The other additions that this version adds is a real bonus for the original DL series.
Maybe it's just the older iPad 2? Not willing to put it on my newer iPad 2 until after the Xmas Concert Weds. Don't want to take a chance yet. ;)
-
Has anyone been able to try AirPlay with MF 3.0.1 update and iOS 8.1.2 that wasn't working with the original MF 3.0?
Until it's confirmed, that's a deal breaker for me right now. Not going to experiment when a pending concert depends on me using AirPlay. :(
-
Did the install
Using ipad2
Latest ios 8.1.2 and mf3.0.1
Tryed mf3 before the update: lag and difficult to get airplay working, slow in swipping switching
After the update : less to none lag, airplay working again whatever i do
Quicker swithing to eq section also quicker in swipping down
Sunday i have my next gig and try it with channels aktive
-
AirPlay still not working on iPad3 with MF 3.0.1 update and iOS 8.1.2
-
Did anyone notice the TALKBACK button and level control that was in the drop down where the solo, reverb and delay are located? I saw it when I first opened the app after the update.....then it disappeared!!!!!!!
So, I speculate we may be getting a nice feature in the near future!!
-
Did anyone notice the TALKBACK button and level control that was in the drop down where the solo, reverb and delay are located? I saw it when I first opened the app after the update.....then it disappeared!!!!!!!
So, I speculate we may be getting a nice feature in the near future!!
It may have switched back to the 1608 demo after your upgrade, I still have the talkback button and level control in the drop down when on a 32r show.
-
Did anyone notice the TALKBACK button and level control that was in the drop down where the solo, reverb and delay are located? I saw it when I first opened the app after the update.....then it disappeared!!!!!!!
So, I speculate we may be getting a nice feature in the near future!!
It may have switched back to the 1608 demo after your upgrade, I still have the talkback button and level control in the drop down when on a 32r show.
Ahhhhhhh, I didn't rea the 32R had talkback!
-
This will probably be a redundant question, but has anyone else here updated to MF 3.0.1 and noticed any improvements over just 3.0? Ampli is using an iPad 2 and noticed an improvement. :thu: Wish I could've said the same thing for my iPad 2. :(
From the various people with iPad 2's the update doesn't seem to affect each one the same way. The technically savvy members here may be able to shed some light, possibly? WK?
-
Why is it no-one here can read Mackie's announcements? Here are the changes for 3.01. No hint of performance changes. I don't think they even test for it.
___3.0.1___
- Bugfix: iPad loses sync when second wireless iPad goes out of range
- Bugfix: App crashes when power-up DL32R with incorrectly formatted HDD attached
- Bugfix: Long song names for HDD recording on DL32R can cause a crash
- Bugfix: Crash when Access Limiting Input DSP and Input Routing and go to Output Routing Channel View
- Bugfix: Access Limits can cause some channels to be incorrectly hidden in Masters View
- Bugfix: Subs and VCAs cannot be muted on aux with "Use LR Mute" disabled
- Bugfix: Sub 6 Missing from VCA Assignment view
- Bugfix: None in mute group selector toggle-able when Multi-Select enabled
- Bugfix: Master Channel View does not respond to Access Limits
- Bugfix: Gated reverb release slider out of alignment
- Bugfix: LPF on Output PEQ's Grow and Glow graphics issue
- Bugfix: Scrolling Labels can do funky things
- Bugfix: Crash logging wasn't working. You may now be prompted to send information after a crash. Please do so.
- Enhancement: Added new reference guide pdf
- Enhancement: Radio buttons now highlight and act on release
- Enhancement: Improved stereo delay time resolution
- Enhancement: Improved labels on output patching tabs for DL32R
What does surprise me is no-one here reported a crash, interesting! ;)
For as long as I can remember someone's slow is another ones fast. That's why they invented time. ::)
-
Right on WK. isn't it odd than practically none of these issues have been reported (that I've seen anyway) and none of the reported and more crucial issues have been addressed! I guess I'll be sticking to 2.1 for a while yet.
-
Sure is a lot of fear of how bad MF 3.0.1 is. It's not bad in my book and the only reason that I can see to not upgrade is if you have to have My Fader in use too. Sure the PEQ are a bit shaky, but that's mostly used up front and not much during a gig. There is that learning curve, and you will need some time to get used to it, but holding off is just putting that off for another day and you still need to do it eventually. OK, for those of you that are using the earliest version of ipad, you don't have the option of upgrading without spending some more cash. That's my take anyway. Happy Holidays to all.
-
PEQ not being used much during a show? This is crazy talk. PEQ is one of the most important tools in professional live mixing. The degraded PEQ function I have experienced with the move to MF 3 is nothing but terrible.
-
PEQ not being used much during a show? This is crazy talk. PEQ is one of the most important tools in professional live mixing. The degraded PEQ function I have experienced with the move to MF 3 is nothing but terrible.
+1
-
I certainly read the bug fix list before downloading MF 3.0.1 to play around with. All these improvements were obviously needed, but if the lag remains for some, the update really doesn’t help a whole lot in that particular regard. If Mackie doesn’t test for it, one can hope that the lag will just disappear all by itself with the next update patch.
Or if it does have to do with an overall faster iPad (CPU) all the iPad 2 owners would have to buy new iPads (rather expensive proposition) or just stay with MF 2.1.1. Which for myself would actually be just fine. The DL worked 100% at last night’s Xmas concert. Couldn’t have been more pleased with it. If I get stuck not being able to update, I will happily use the DL until it has to be retired or myself, whichever comes first. The only thing that might of helped would be Trim adjustment. But still not a real big deal for me. ;)
-
Why is it no-one here can read Mackie's announcements? Here are the changes for 3.01. No hint of performance changes. I don't think they even test for it.
___3.0.1___
- Bugfix: iPad loses sync when second wireless iPad goes out of range
- Bugfix: App crashes when power-up DL32R with incorrectly formatted HDD attached
- Bugfix: Long song names for HDD recording on DL32R can cause a crash
- Bugfix: Crash when Access Limiting Input DSP and Input Routing and go to Output Routing Channel View
- Bugfix: Access Limits can cause some channels to be incorrectly hidden in Masters View
- Bugfix: Subs and VCAs cannot be muted on aux with "Use LR Mute" disabled
- Bugfix: Sub 6 Missing from VCA Assignment view
- Bugfix: None in mute group selector toggle-able when Multi-Select enabled
- Bugfix: Master Channel View does not respond to Access Limits
- Bugfix: Gated reverb release slider out of alignment
- Bugfix: LPF on Output PEQ's Grow and Glow graphics issue
- Bugfix: Scrolling Labels can do funky things
- Bugfix: Crash logging wasn't working. You may now be prompted to send information after a crash. Please do so.
- Enhancement: Added new reference guide pdf
- Enhancement: Radio buttons now highlight and act on release
- Enhancement: Improved stereo delay time resolution
- Enhancement: Improved labels on output patching tabs for DL32R
What does surprise me is no-one here reported a crash, interesting! ;)
For as long as I can remember someone's slow is another ones fast. That's why they invented time. ::)
I did read the release notes for the update, I guess I was just hoping that maybe one of the bug fixes and or product enhancements might also effect the performance.
Don't get me wrong; I really like the new MF3 when I'm running it on my ipad Air 2 with the 32r for the most part it seams very solid and I love the new features. Unfortunately though I am looking to now sell my 1608 with the ipad as the 30pin ipads are no longer sold. Mackie may be willing to have their name on a poorly performing piece of equipment, but I am not. I wouldn't feel right selling the mixer to a another band and friend if I don't believe its 100% and with the slow page loads and laggy PEQ I don't believe it is.
Thankfully though, I remembered I have a 1608 running 2.1.1 at a fixed install and I was able to head up there last night and get a copy of 2.1.1. I was able to downgrade and now I feel comfortable selling the 1608 to another band. As others have stated it would be nice if Mackie had both versions available on iTunes, so if we decide to stay loyal to the brand when upgrading we can feel confident selling our old gear.
Cheers,
-
PEQ not being used much during a show? This is crazy talk. PEQ is one of the most important tools in professional live mixing. The degraded PEQ function I have experienced with the move to MF 3 is nothing but terrible.
Same here. They need to fix this, or offer updates that restore 2.x. I'm really glad I did not update, and up until now I've been a huge advocate for the DL series mixers. This problem has to be resolved or I will be looking at another product.
-
All those people buying new 806s and 1608s won't have much of a choice. Automatically stuck or not stuck with MF 3.0.1 I guess it's all how you look at it too. If you don't know about these little bugs it probably won't affect you in any way. Of course, unless you're a member or lurker on this forum. ;)
-
Thankfully though, I remembered I have a 1608 running 2.1.1 at a fixed install and I was able to head up there last night and get a copy of 2.1.1. I was able to downgrade and now I feel comfortable selling the 1608 to another band. As others have stated it would be nice if Mackie had both versions available on iTunes, so if we decide to stay loyal to the brand when upgrading we can feel confident selling our old gear.
Sorry to pee on your parade - but as soon as you wipe your account off of the iPad you'll lose V2.1.1 . As it's DRM'd to your account you can't ever load it into an iPad not on your account.
-
Just tried the X Air App on my older iPad 2 and there was quite a bit of fader lag just like running MF 3.0.1. In this case I’m leaning towards an overall lack of horsepower on my older iPad 2 to run these apps. This is with any background apps closed and only MF and or X Air running, one at a time.
MF 2.1.1 is as smooth as silk. The faders respond almost instantly to touch. As long as I have a backup of MF 2.1.1 in iTunes, it may worth loading MF 3.X or the X Air App on the newer iPad 2 to compare.
Of course it may just be the older iPad that is not up to snuff, even though both pads have the same internals. :)
-
Sorry to pee on your parade - but as soon as you wipe your account off of the iPad you'll lose V2.1.1 . As it's DRM'd to your account you can't ever load it into an iPad not on your account.
Hi RR,
So I restored the iPad and set it up as a new iPad without an account, I then loaded MF2.1.1 which is working well. I then set the iPad up on a friends iTunes account, the app is still there and working well.
Is there something I am missing as to why it shouldnt work?
Doesn't appear to be any trace of my account on the iPad. Now that I think of it, when I did my last dl1608 install I initially used my account to download the apps, then it was switched to a new account after the install with no issues.
-
Well, maybe it only applies to paid apps - I thought it was all apps? Your iPad isn't jailbroken I assume?
Interesting, in that case anybody should be able to roll back if they can "find" a copy of the old app ;) .
-
If anybody wants to try it PM me and I'll send you a link to my MF2.1.1.ipa
-
Well, maybe it only applies to paid apps - I thought it was all apps? Your iPad isn't jailbroken I assume?
Interesting, in that case anybody should be able to roll back if they can "find" a copy of the old app ;) .
Nope, not jailbroken. I hope it works for others, I imagine we'll find out fairly shortly.
Not sure why Mackie doesn't just offer two versions on the App store. I have seen several app designers do this in the past when they decide they want to make their already paid customers buy something new; Djay and Tango are good examples although Tango finally caved to the nasty reviews and gave it to us as an update. You would think it would just make good business sense to offer both until you get the bugs worked out and MyFader 3 finished.
Cheers,
-
I'm all for two different versions on the app store. Also, Mackie's latest version is so good, that a fee for the upgrade would be OK for me. (Think it would have to be over $20 to bother me, though I'd probably pay $50 and grumble.) So for all those people avoiding upgrading because it isn't perfect, if it were perfect, how much would you be willing to spend. (a 30 day free trial would be appropriate to see if you wanted to live with it.)
-
Not sure why Mackie doesn't just offer two versions on the App store. I have seen several app designers do this in the past when they decide they want to make their already paid customers buy something new; Djay and Tango are good examples although Tango finally caved to the nasty reviews and gave it to us as an update. You would think it would just make good business sense to offer both until you get the bugs worked out and MyFader 3 finished.
Kinda amusing aside - when Tango came out with the new version they made the old version free with the caveat that it was buggy with the latest iOS. Those of us that grabbed up the old version for free eventually got the new version for free :) . I'll often grab something when it's free even if it's not immediately useful to me but at least somewhat interesting, sometimes later updates make them useful :) .
-
Kinda amusing aside - when Tango came out with the new version they made the old version free with the caveat that it was buggy with the latest iOS. Those of us that grabbed up the old version for free eventually got the new version for free :) . I'll often grab something when it's free even if it's not immediately useful to me but at least somewhat interesting, sometimes later updates make them useful :) .
I wasn't so lucky, paid $5 for Tango and $20 for djay 1. Although both have been worth every penny, and I did finally get the Tango update for free. Wow, if you ever want a shock look back through your iTunes reciepts :o Between music and apps I could have bought my DL32r ;) maybe two..
-
I'm all for two different versions on the app store. Also, Mackie's latest version is so good, that a fee for the upgrade would be OK for me. (Think it would have to be over $20 to bother me, though I'd probably pay $50 and grumble.) So for all those people avoiding upgrading because it isn't perfect, if it were perfect, how much would you be willing to spend. (a 30 day free trial would be appropriate to see if you wanted to live with it.)
I think the free product updates and new features are what keep a lot of us loyal to Mackie and the DL's. I have no need to look elsewhere as long as I keep getting little presents from Mackie in the app store from time to time, and I do love MF3 on the air 2. :) If I had to pay for them I might spend a little more time shopping the competition.
-
I'm all for two different versions on the app store. Also, Mackie's latest version is so good, that a fee for the upgrade would be OK for me. (Think it would have to be over $20 to bother me, though I'd probably pay $50 and grumble.) So for all those people avoiding upgrading because it isn't perfect, if it were perfect, how much would you be willing to spend. (a 30 day free trial would be appropriate to see if you wanted to live with it.)
I might pay up to $50.00 for it, if all that money from everyone who owns or buys a DL was going into R&D. How many would really pony up that kind of money after spending anywhere from $600 US for an 806 to $2000 US for a DL32? Sure $20-$50.00 isn’t much in the general scheme of things, if you’re budgeting gear money and working with said gear on a regular basis, $50.00 isn’t too hard to lay down.
If you’re working occasionally, up to $50 is a little harder to justify for software that’s necessary to run your gear. All name brand computers have the O/S installed, which is included and part of the purchase price, unless you decide blow it off and install from scratch. Then you have to buy it. Obviously MF cannot be installed on every iPad everywhere before you buy the iPad. We are lucky that Mackie and the other digital mixer manufacturers make their front end/control apps free. :)
-
If anybody wants to try it PM me and I'll send you a link to my MF2.1.1.ipa
Hi Sam,
Has anyone taken you up on your offer? Curious to see if you have the same luck.. :)
-
We are lucky that Mackie and the other digital mixer manufacturers make their front end/control apps free. :)
I'm not going to say "never", but I would NEVER buy a mixer that didn't come with a control whether it be physical faders or an iPad app ,never. ;)
-
TBF a mixer which had no faders would not be a functioning product without a control app of some kind and no manufacturer would sell such a product.
A couple of people have PMd me for the link but no feedback so far. If you have a copy of the MF2 .ipa then save it before updating to MF3 and do the update on the iPad not in iTunes, if you don't sync the iPad until you're sure you're happy with MF3 you should be able to revert to MF2. I have done this once and it worked for me but I can't guarantee it would work for others.
-
For anyone interested, I just played around with MF 3.0.1 and X-Air Apps on my newer iPad 2, and the same results. Slow responding faders. MF 2.1.1 faders practically move exactly with your finger or stylus. This seems to be a more natural almost physical fader response IMHO. I realize that they can't be 100%. But MF 2.1.1 is pretty darn close. I know that the fader lag is not the only annoyance in 3.x
Of course this may all be due to the iPad 2 itself. I'd love to test it on a newer model of iPad to see if it makes a difference. Don't really want to invest $440.00 CDN right now for a new iPad Air 16GB . It's not in the cards or going to be under the Christmas Tree this year. :( Have to save my pennies up. I could always ask for Xmas, birthday and Fathers Day? :angel:
-
If anybody wants to try it PM me and I'll send you a link to my MF2.1.1.ipa
Hi Sam,
I think that's very good of you to make your MF 2.1.1 file available for anyone who needs it. :thu: :thu:
A very Merry Christmas to you and your family! Thank you for sharing and caring. ;)
-
I don't intend to broadcast the link but if it is DRMd it won't be of use to others, if not there's nothing specific to my iTunes so no problem.
-
Went to set up my mixer last night before I headed out to my gig and MF3.0 would launch and immediately crash. Now I am not sure if this is linked to the removal of TestFlight, as I had a preview version, but it caused a bit of panic. I restarted the iPad, still didn't work, then installed the latest iOS patch, didn't work, so removed MF and installed the new version... hey presto we were in business again. Unfortunately, I lost all of my shows and presets from the last 2.5 years, a bit annoying, but I'll get over it.
Anyway, so back up and running, I set what I could up for my gig and then headed out. Docking the iPad instigated the firmware update and then everything was operating as normal. Now, I'm running an iPad 2 (one of the late models, as the 3 came out) and generally, on small movements with the faders I am getting very little lag, the amount I would expect on a touchscreen I guess. Bigger movements have some, but I am talking about almost a full fader swipe at speed, which I don't have to do often when engineering thankfully. It was stable bar one loss of connection (which I am still convinced is a iOS issue, not MF) and I could move between screens at a reasonable pace to tweak EQ, compression, monitor levels, effects settings, etc. The mute buttons responded immediately, which is good, as I use a long delay for some songs which needs to be cut in and out at the right time.
Overall, I am pretty happy with the performance of the desk and application, for me it is up to the job and I would still recommend it without hesitation, though I am conscious that other peoples' experience has been less than ideal.
On a general note, I was one of those people that was a bit annoyed I had to buy a Fruit product to work this mixer, but now I am sort of glad. The reason for this being that even with a relatively controlled software and hardware set, there are still enough variances to cause different users to experience different issues. If this had been opened up and there were Android and Windows platforms to support as well, then I think it would have caused both Mackie and us a whole load more headaches. If they continue to produce products using a unified application, then I think that in the longer term they will probably need to port out to other platforms... ideally when they have the resources and skills to do so.
-
Of course the original controlling software should be included with a mixer. But until last year, every OS upgrade for a Mac was an extra fee. With mixers, the incremental updates should be free. Major updates like MF 3.x would be OK to charge for. (With a free 2 week to 30 day trial.) My other thought is the level of software development should rise with additional income going back to the company. (Though, MF 3.x is pretty good. They did have a new product to help drive development.)
-
Thinking along Wynnd lines I would have no problem paying a small "app" fee for a major release.
I could choose if I felt it was worth the investment and if it benefited my needs. Of course, bug fixes and minor upgrades should always be free. If it helped fund R & D of improvements, it would be well worth a small fee.
On a different note, I did a show yesterday for a Engineering firms annual X mas get together. Mostly background music, a few mics for award presentations, and interfacing with their computer screen for showing of videos they produce but lack decent sound gear for the audio playback. Now this firm is the largest in this area with offices in Cleveland, Pittsburgh, New York and Columbus. They had about 150 Engineers present. Mostly Mechanical. Electrical, IT and a few that design for theater and church audio. Of course they were quite interested in watching the remote controlling of the sound and how I was able to control everything and switch songs from my ipod from across the room. Most the guys in audio were quite familiar with the product (one had just specified an DL32R for a new synagogue) but they had fun actually playing with this hands on. I had left it with the vintage EQ setting on all channels for my benefit but was able to show them the PEQ screen. I did not demonstrate the lag to them, but only explained this is the beta version of V 3.1
I think they came away with a nice feel for the product.
-
If anybody wants to try it PM me and I'll send you a link to my MF2.1.1.ipa
Hi Sam,
Has anyone taken you up on your offer? Curious to see if you have the same luck.. :)
I've now had feedback that my copy of MF2.1.1.ipa does NOT work on an iPad associated with a different iTunes account (I suspect that, as well as needing the computer authorised to my account, it would only allow the iPad to be synced with the iTunes library also associated with that account, and I wouldn't be surprised if you can't have a computer authorised with two iTunes accounts). Seems like this is another blind alley :(
-
One could try iFunBox to load the .ipa file but as I said it's my understanding that won't work because of DRM. OTOH I could be misinformed?
-
I can't see Apple letting an app designed to circumvent their DRM on the App Store so I'd put (a small amount of) money on you being right 8) .
-
This is were a real company concerned about their customers steps up to the plate and provides a solution for their screw up. Mackie put up MF2. The MF 3 Beta should only have been posted for the DL32R and certainly not for the DL1608/806. Limited exposure would have served you well. Separating the MF apps into two distinct releases would have made far more sense. The hardware has enough differences to warrant this. How do you like the iJail? Android is winning because of this and other technological reasons.
-
Not sure I entirely agree with you WK but I certainly would welcome Mackie making MF2 available on iTunes alongside MF3, if only because it is much better suited to non-techie users. They could designate it MasterFader Lite v1.0. What about it Mackie?
-
Not sure I entirely agree with you WK but I certainly would welcome Mackie making MF2 available on iTunes alongside MF3, if only because it is much better suited to non-techie users. They could designate it MasterFader Lite v1.0. What about it Mackie?
As they say "to each his own" and I don't really care what they name it. Maybe Working MF (WMF)?
-
;D
-
It would be nice to see the V.2 up on the App Store for those that desire it.
I would be really torn about going back, while I really dislike the lag issue I would be
Reluctant to give up subgroups and my new understanding of VCAs. There are so many
Really nice things about V.3 that I would be tempted to just put up with the lag, and use the
vintage mode until a fix was found.
Sure would be nice to be able to keep V2 on the iPad 2 and put 3 on the ipad 3.
-
Just like only an artist can call a painting done, Only Mackie can call Master Fader 3.x a Beta. (Or not) I can't find anywhere in the app that calls it a Beta. So it's probably time to stop calling it a Beta. From what I've heard, I doubt that any version of Master Fader will ever make some people happy. If there's the slightest hiccup, it will be overblown in Importance and people will threaten to find a "better" product. (Don't any of these people remember multi-tasking with Windows 95? There were lots of people who didn't think that was multi-tasking at all.)
-
Some people have issues with 3.x and some don’t. If you haven’t updated, you’re okay for now. If you have updated? Look at some of the members here who have updated and would really rather go back if they could. I’ve been reading posts here about all the troubles with 3.x and have experienced the lag issue myself and was lucky enough to go back.
Why would I update right now if MF 2.1.1 is working perfectly? Of course I’d like some of the benefits of 3.x on the DL1608, but they’re not critical enough to me to update just yet, until hopefully the “minor” issues are addressed, if they ever will be?
I am hoping very much that the next iteration of MF 3.X will address these “minor” issues very soon for myself and everyone else here who is frustrated with it. I don’t think that there will ever be a perfect software for everyone’s tastes, but I hope this one in particular will get closer with further research and a good listening ear from Mackie. We just have to keep hammering the Mackie Customer Feedback Site.
-
With the original ipad not being able to upgrade to Master Fader 3 and the lack of a My Fader 3, Mackie clearly should have kept MF 2.x available. (In my mind as long as these mixers are expected to last. 10 years is probably a minimum and whenever support quits, they should open up the architecture to the public.) I guess that the only other option in the long run is for Mackie to make their own tablet with custom software and abandon other company products. (And as an Apple stockholder, that wouldn't be good for the price.) There is something to be said for custom OS on a tablet. How complicated could it be if you're only building a product for one use? Tablets are fairly simple in functions. WiFi is most likely to most complicated and that is a solid technology. For that matter, a custom wifi addition to a mixer doesn't have to be a tablet. It just needs to be portable, relatively light and wireless. (And we get back into my discussion of real faders vs virtual faders.) This is where the DL32R could get a better remote controller. Leave the connections onstage and thin client out into the audience with real faders, a large touch pad with batteries and a directional antenna. (Could also be doing infrared by someone could walk infront of the light.)
-
This is were a real company concerned about their customers steps up to the plate and provides a solution for their screw up. Mackie put up MF2. The MF 3 Beta should only have been posted for the DL32R and certainly not for the DL1608/806. Limited exposure would have served you well. Separating the MF apps into two distinct releases would have made far more sense. The hardware has enough differences to warrant this. How do you like the iJail? Android is winning because of this and other technological reasons.
This is worth repeating. Mackie, please make MF2 available!
-
Separating the MF apps into two distinct releases would have made far more sense. The hardware has enough differences to warrant this.
Like, Like and more Like !
-
Just like only an artist can call a painting done, Only Mackie can call Master Fader 3.x a Beta. (Or not) I can't find anywhere in the app that calls it a Beta. So it's probably time to stop calling it a Beta. From what I've heard, I doubt that any version of Master Fader will ever make some people happy. If there's the slightest hiccup, it will be overblown in Importance and people will threaten to find a "better" product. (Don't any of these people remember multi-tasking with Windows 95? There were lots of people who didn't think that was multi-tasking at all.)
Not up to me or you, BenO called it a Beta on this forum.
Topic: Master Fader 3.0 Public Beta Test (Read 1300 times)
beno
Mackie Product Manager
Master Fader 3.0 Public Beta Test
« on: November 10, 2014, 09:09:42 AM »
Hello All,
We are nearing the release of Master Fader 3.0. As such we are looking for a few brave users to help us test the final release. This public beta will help ensure that the upgrade and Show/Snapshot translation is working properly. With so many different combinations of parameters in your Shows/Snapshots, we want to be sure they update properly and work as expected in 3.0.........
http://cacophony.aspinock.com/index.php?topic=763.0
Ever wonder why he only posted that request here and nowhere else??? The only two day Beta I've ever encountered. :)
Wynnd just for your reading pleasure I thought you might enjoy this.
http://forums.theregister.co.uk/forum/1/2014/01/28/stephen_fry_says_kildall_was_cracked/#c_2091797
Happy Holidays.
-
I was part of the public Beta test and when MF 3.0 was released, I upgraded. Don't know if it was required, but the public Beta required Apple's Flighttest to run. The release version didn't. (Might have been some other reason for flight test, but I deleted the public Beta and Flight Test and installed MF 3.0) I can't see the difference, but I did have it for more than 2 days. Ben had said that they had Beta tested it in house before we got ahold of it, so I wasn't expecting many issues and only found one. (Forgot to check and see if .0.1 fixed that. Really isn't a serious problem, more of one that looks bad when it really isn't. And no one on the forum has mentioned it, so apparently I'm the only one here beside's Ben that knows about it. And I'm not providing additional ammunition to bitch about. So don't bother asking about it.)
-
It was closer to two weeks... I got told off for talking about Fader Club :lol:
-
What am I the only one that can still do math here?? It was the 10th for the request (see above) and it was posted on the 17th. That's seven days and Apple usually takes 3-5 days to get it into the APP store that leaves 2-4 days tops. ::) Time for a new set of Mackie Beta testers (pre and post fader).
-
As I recall, we weren't allowed to discuss our involvement in the Beta testing before the release of the product. Product is out. It's been so long that I can't recall what I thought at the time. I'm liking the new app. But I had my friend run sound for me last Saturday and the additional complexity makes this a better mixer for the familiar and a worse mixer for Joe Average. Next time I need a sit-in, I will probably use my small mixer as it's much simpler to use. (Alesis Multi-Mix 16 firewire)
-
Next time you need a sit-in fly one of us out to Denver for a night !
I'm sure you can find a taker that would like to visit Colorado and check out the new "legislation" ;)
-
Took the bull by the horns and upgraded to 3.0.1
Just done 2 gigs over the weekend, and although I was nervous and took a spare desk with me, I am pleased to report that I had no issues, I use 14 channels and 6 Aux, for full band line up.
Point to note when I updated the App Ipad2 seemed to freeze for about 10 minutes, with no indication or bar that anything is going on, however just be patient, all of sudden it came to life. Same happened with 2 other ipad 2.
Really like some of the new features
-
Decided to play around with MF 3.0.1, to give it another whirl. Loaded on the older iPad 2. I did back it up completely in iTunes first, in case I need to roll back. The fader lag is a little more than v 2.1.1, but after a while working with it, it doesn’t seem too, too bad. Haven’t updated the other iPad or done the firmware update on the DL yet.
With enough practice unconnected first, it shouldn’t be too hard to use it in a live situation. I only use the vintage EQ, so that’s not an issue for me. The interface is little more complicated than v 2.x but practice makes perfect. As it is, I feel I could use it live right now. The digital trim feature in particular is worth the update, I think.
I don’t have any upcoming gigs for a while and the DL is at home so if I update it and it doesn’t work I can roll the whole “kitten caboodle” back. I know I’ve done a complete turnaround contrary to my posts against updating, but, “Might As Well Jump” as they say. ;)
Jan 16th 2014: (didn't update the firmware yet)
Played around with the new version, slow fader response was noticeable. Modern EQ was horrible, although I never use it and won't affect me in any way. Compared it to v 2.x on the other iPad and there was little to no lag anywhere. Just put back v2.x on the test iPad. Going to keep both at 2.x for the for seeable future, until the next update to MF 3.x comes along, probably, hopefully after NAMM, when they release My Fader 3.x :)
-
I'm keeping 2.1 on mine until something new is released or Mackie confirms the fix. I'm prepared to keep it this way indefinitely if I have to, as I really don't care about most of the upgrades, and I love the modern EQ.
-
I am still confused as to how there are such different experiences from different users of MF3. Either we all have very different and significant tolerances or there is something more fundamental going on with software clashes, etc. Would be great if we could all get together and see if we are all experiencing the same thing
-
I'm pretty sure that while our general experiences are similar, that the PEQ modern channel lag is either very different or our acceptance of it is very different. At least the white noise issue appears to be completely gone. (And the world is a better place.)
-
The white noise issue was never an issue for me in particular. After reading about it here, quite a while back, I decided never to tempt fate, especially in a performance setting. I always use an iPod Touch for audio playback either connected directly to channels 15 & 16 in stereo, or through AirPlay. But the white noise problem should never have happened just the same, out of the gate. Thank goodness this issue disappeared with MF 3.x though. :thu
I have a sneaking suspicion that it’s not actually MF 3.x with the issues. I’m leaning towards a lack of processing power in the older iPads. I think Wynnd mentioned a while back that MF 3.x is a total re design from the ground up and quite possibly just requires more CPU / system RAM to run smoothly. And the older iPads cannot handle it. I may be just talking absolute poodoo here, but that’s my impression. I’m sure the more tech savvy members will be able to explain this better than I can.
It is quite interesting that there are quite different experiences on the same hardware/software to quote ijpengelly. I'd be interested to find out too.
-
I still think the problem is In the program. The PEQ delay and slowness to open up various functions did not occur with the older version.
Now I realize the new program may require more processing power but many have this same issue with newer iPads too. I for one, have 3 iPads that experience this problem. The newest is a iPad mini2 that i have tried undocked.
While I can deal with it thanks to vintage eq., I am more upset that Mackie has yet to acknowledge the issue and let us out here know there is a effort being made to find a resolution. I find it becoming harder to continue singing the praises of the system when the mfg. is ignoring an obvious problem.
Of course we all still await my fader 3 so we can have our iPods and iPhones back on line.
-
I hope this is addressed too, but it should wait until at least MyFader 3.x is out and running. While it might be interesting to know how many programmers Mackie is using, I know enough about programming to know that things don't go as smoothly as desired. (Ben O was hoping to have My Fader out before 2015. That obviously didn't happen.) It helps to limit the number of issues being addressed when attacking problems. I don't see the Modern PEQ lag as the top priority until MyFader is released. After it's release, it might jump to the top of the pile. There is that issue when attempting to improve performance on a specific section of a program that you might cause other problems. Gonna be some very soft stepping there. Be patient and let Mackie get it right. Hopefully by 2016 this problem will be forgotten.
-
I still think the problem is In the program. The PEQ delay and slowness to open up various functions did not occur with the older version.
Now I realize the new program may require more processing power but many have this same issue with newer iPads too. I for one, have 3 iPads that experience this problem. The newest is a iPad mini2 that i have tried undocked.
While I can deal with it thanks to vintage eq., I am more upset that Mackie has yet to acknowledge the issue and let us out here know there is a effort being made to find a resolution. I find it becoming harder to continue singing the praises of the system when the mfg. is ignoring an obvious problem.
Of course we all still await my fader 3 so we can have our iPods and iPhones back on line.
Thank you Rdmitch for opening my eyes. If this is going on across all iPad models new or old, albeit a small or bigger number, this is a Mackie issue. I know that there are some here that it’s a non-issue for and that’s great. I’m fairly certain there are others out there not on the forum that are having the same problems.
Hi Wynnd,
I just read your post after I posted mine on this topic and had to revise. You make a lot of sense and I do agree with you. The hardware platform is quite good and if we are all patient, hopefully Mackie will get it right, sooner rather than later, though. The lag is not a deal breaker, but rather a frustration that for some, including myself is not a good thing. I'm lucky that I can still stay on v2.x. I think that if I had just bought a new DL, I wouldn't have even realized there was a problem. And of course never read anything about any issues on the forum. ;)
-
I'm curious if anyone is using a iPad air 2 and not having any issues.
Each iPad version uses a different processor and the iPad minis use either the A5 or A7 chip
But the new iPad air 2 uses the A8 which is claimed to be faster.
Just curious
-
The GEQ lag has seemed to be ipad model independent. I've seen more complaints about the more recent models. I have an ipad 2 and an ipad mini. (earlier model.) And while I can see the lag, it's not bugging me. (might just be my personal approach to this board and PAs in general.) I believe in having a system that is quite flat and I don't do much channel GEQ adjusting. And when I do make changes, it's always before the performance begins. While I'm sure it's not perfect, it's very functional and I can live with functional.
-
The "lag" might be mostly on the Retina models (post "2" and "original mini") as those take a lot more computations to do the graphics?
-
The "lag" might be mostly on the Retina models (post "2" and "original mini") as those take a lot more computations to do the graphics?
From what this link shows: http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/ipad/specs/apple-ipad-mini-retina-2nd-gen-a1489-wi-fi-only-specs.html
There is more system memory, to supposedly support the retina display? It should do the trick, but maybe not enough memory? Am I in left field here?
And this link shows the iPad Air 2 system memory and CPU specs. http://www.phonearena.com/phones/Apple-iPad-Air-2_id8948
This should be more than enough to run MF 3.x smoothly? Out in left field again, I am ? But unless you are in the market for a new iPad, or rolling in money, it's an expensive solution to be able to run MF 3.X as it should run. And if it does run better on the iPad Air 2, too?
Just looked up the CDN price for the iPad Air 2, just picking myself up off the floor... $549.00 before tax. OMG :eek: And that's the 16GB model too. :o
-
It's hard to figure out if the added processing power if needed for the retina display, or if there is more processing to help apps run better. I would like to find someone with an iPad air 2 and try it to see what happens.
They tout the new A8 chip as faster and better for graphics.
The original iPad air is a A7 (same as a mini2) but supposedly has better architecture was th the 64 bit.
You can get a iPad air, 32 GB for $ 450.00 new at any Walmart. eBay for $ 300.00 (USD)
The air2 is about the same price for the 16 GB.
I only wish mackie would help give the direction to go. I'm not buying another iPad (unless I sell my others first)
I don't have enough gigs booked for this year yet to warrant any expenses, March thru Sept. are my money making months and hopefully by then the problem will be resolved.
Also you need the Lightning adaptor kit to make it a permanent install.
-
Hopefully we'll hear more from Mackie after (or during?) NAMM ...
-
Thumbs up to that 🔉
-
Patiently waiting in eager anticipation. ;)
-
Hate to see you guys turn blue, so don't hold your breath. ;)
-
Totally hear you on that, will absolutely not be holding my breath waiting.😵
However, I did find on eBay a incredible buy on a iPad air2 , I'll have to hope it's legit.
At least once that shows up I can determine if there is any noticable difference with the latest, greatest iPad.
Fortunately, I was able to sell and/or repurpose my other ipad(s)
-
Totally hear you on that, will absolutely not be holding my breath waiting.😵
However, I did find on eBay a incredible buy on a iPad air2 , I'll have to hope it's legit.
At least once that shows up I can determine if there is any noticable difference with the latest, greatest iPad.
Fortunately, I was able to sell and/or repurpose my other ipad(s)
It’s interesting that you have to go buy an iPad Air 2, albeit from eBay to see if MF 3.X will work like it’s supposed to on a faster CPU and more system ram, even though said app should work just as well on the older platforms. I know that you're doing it for testing purposes and buying a new iPad is kinda cool too. At least you, hopefully got some good change from your older iPads to defray the cost of the new one?
-
It was a item I wanted to upgrade anyway. My wife wanted my iPad, and I wanted a new one with the retina display since I also use it for watching Netflix. One of the guys in our office wanted a mini...so he bought my mini.
I would not have purchased the air2 it at full price , but at the price I found it for and with all the trading off I did it really didn't cost anything. I still have a iPad 3 with all my tunes in it which I will keep with the DL. I figure I'll try the air2 and if it works ...great.
No one should have to replace there iPad to compensate for the program problem. If there was a known issue mackie probably would have put a disclosure on the app. I think it's a problem they will overcome in time and I sure wish that would come soon.
-
It was a item I wanted to upgrade anyway. My wife wanted my iPad, and I wanted a new one with the retina display since I also use it for watching Netflix. One of the guys in our office wanted a mini...so he bought my mini.
I would not have purchased the air2 it at full price , but at the price I found it for and with all the trading off I did it really didn't cost anything. I still have a iPad 3 with all my tunes in it which I will keep with the DL. I figure I'll try the air2 and if it works ...great.
No one should have to replace there iPad to compensate for the program problem. If there was a known issue mackie probably would have put a disclosure on the app. I think it's a problem they will overcome in time and I sure wish that would come soon.
That's good you didn't spend a lot on the iPad Air 2. I'd love to buy one, but having 2 iPad 2's (too?) unless one dies, I can't justify right now. Oh well! I hope that MF 3.x does work better for you. I agree that Mackie will eventually straighten things out.
I could've used the digital trim alone, last night for a school board presentation. I did preset the gains, but couldn't run up to the side stage (where DL was setup) to tweak during the show. Not too professional looking. But the DL ran flawlessly for the duration and the sound was pretty good considering it was in a school gym. Sure didn't need reverb! :facepalm:
Be nice if and when you find out, you can post back here? :)
-
We upgrade software all the time. Last time I upgraded my Cubase was when an Apple OS-X upgrade killed off my Cubase 3SE. Cost me $100 and the results are I'm at a better place than I was before. Wouldn't be that strange to have to upgrade hardware in the same way. (Cubase Artist 6)
-
Not quite the same situation. I don't expect to have to upgrade the ipads that I bought at the same time I bought the mixer (iPad3 and original mini). It's going to become impossible to stay with MF2 in the long run since it is no longer available for any new ipad added to the system. I tried contacting Mackie about what i consider to be an unacceptable situation and got the following reply from BenO:
As you know, Master Fader v3.0 adds a ton of new UI features. This requires more CPU processing from the iPad. Unfortunately, this means that some older iPad including iPad 2, iPad 3 and iPad mini will operate slower on graphic intensive screens like mixer view, overview and the EQ. These devices are already got slower with iOS8 than with iOS7 for the same reason. For the best performance, we recommend an iPad Air or iPad mini 2 or newer.
The iPad 3 has the same CPU as the iPad 2, but because it is Retina, has 4 times as many pixels to process. So screens that require CPU intensive tasks will be slower on the iPad 3 than the older iPad 2 and iPad mini. The EQ view is the most CPU intensive screen as you make changes since the iPad needs to recalculate the EQ curve. Thus the iPad 3 EQ has the slowest response to changes.
We are looking into if there are any more performance optimizations that can be done. The EQ screen in particular is on the top of our list and is being improved for the next update.
I hope this helps.
Ben
Here's hoping!
-
pytchley:
Thank you for sharing that with the forum. :thu: That does clear up the questions, at least for myself. But it leaves me with the decision to either stay with MF 2.1.1 and my iPad 2’s, which work just fine for what I do, or iPad Air, new tray or adapter connection kit and MF 3.X. From what the reply from BenO states, Mackie is looking into this. This is good.
But the real reality is that any new software/OS updates do require more horsepower to run effectively. If you want to play, you have to pay. I’m not in any position to upgrade my iPads at this time. MF 2.X it is or MF 3.X and just live with the small lags. After another gig and really wishing for digital trim, I might just be leaning towards MF 3.X. But in the meantime, I will in particular wait for possible improvements from Mackie. But to quote WK, I won’t turn blue holding my breath. ;)
-
Not quite the same situation. I don't expect to have to upgrade the ipads that I bought at the same time I bought the mixer (iPad3 and original mini). It's going to become impossible to stay with MF2 in the long run since it is no longer available for any new ipad added to the system. I tried contacting Mackie about what i consider to be an unacceptable situation and got the following reply from BenO:
As you know, Master Fader v3.0 adds a ton of new UI features. This requires more CPU processing from the iPad. Unfortunately, this means that some older iPad including iPad 2, iPad 3 and iPad mini will operate slower on graphic intensive screens like mixer view, overview and the EQ. These devices are already got slower with iOS8 than with iOS7 for the same reason. For the best performance, we recommend an iPad Air or iPad mini 2 or newer.
The iPad 3 has the same CPU as the iPad 2, but because it is Retina, has 4 times as many pixels to process. So screens that require CPU intensive tasks will be slower on the iPad 3 than the older iPad 2 and iPad mini. The EQ view is the most CPU intensive screen as you make changes since the iPad needs to recalculate the EQ curve. Thus the iPad 3 EQ has the slowest response to changes.
We are looking into if there are any more performance optimizations that can be done. The EQ screen in particular is on the top of our list and is being improved for the next update.
I hope this helps.
Ben
Here's hoping!
After picking myself off the floor from laughing at BenO's usual marketing BS, let me point out the the BS. First adding functionality ("ton of features" more like a handful) does not necessarily add response time issues since the code is not being serially executed one would hope. Adding a new screen should not affect the response on an existing one (no code or minor dress-up changes) ::). BenO clearly doesn't know the difference between an iPad 2 and 3. Apple was well aware of the impact of the Retina display would have hence the 5X processor with double the GPU power with more efficiency in the 3. There are plenty of performance tests to back this up. Definitely not the same CPU as the 2. This falls apart even more since the same EQ curve ran fine on V2.x on the same hardware. iOS 8 on the other hand added 4000 new and changed library routines (the real code base in most apps) and many Apps needed to be changed to take advantage and also eliminate speed issues. Case in point MusicStudio was useless under iOS 8 until they fixed the problem. Yes they are fixable but you need to understand the changes and 4000 is non-trivial. Knowing Mackie management they probably didn't want to spend the money to educate their Software engineer let alone some marketing type. Then off course there is the real design blunder of combining the code base of the DL32R with the DL1608 in a single MF binary adding tons of decision logic to the code, just to save a few pennies with Apple. The same reason V2.x is not in the App store. Oh and there is that evil empire of Software Engineers at BE.... that seem to have no problem with the Retina display. >:D
-
“Then of course there is the real design blunder of combining the code base of the DL32R with the DL1608 in a single MF binary adding tons of decision logic to the code, just to save a few pennies with Apple.”
I guess they didn’t want to leave the DL 806/1608 platform owners in the lurch with new software only for the DL32? I think a lot here would’ve preferred to have v2.1.1 still available as a separate app. And of course the real reason, to save money. Isn’t this similar to MS and Windows 8.x and now the upcoming Windows 10? One OS for all devices? In reality this doesn’t always work.
Hell, I’m using 8.1 and I love it, but the Start Screen IMHO really lends itself better to touch screens. I have a touch screen laptop, but am using StartIsBack for the traditional desktop and benefiting from 8.1 under the hood. Too bad Mackie couldn’t have made some option that allowed MF to identify which platform it was on and select the appropriate interface for that platform. I know, smoking that funny stuff again. If wishes were fishes I suppose. ;)
-
Is that stuff legal in Canada? The solution is trivial since all assemblers and compilers I'm aware of have had conditionals for decades. This also gets rid of unwanted bloat. Just needs two binaries and according to Apple's rules requires separate Apps. Read my lips BenO Master Fader 16 and Master Fader 32. :) Same source code base.
-
I'm running MF3 on an ipad 2 and don't find it lacking in power. There is a bit of a lag in the channel PEQ modern, but I don't find it unacceptable. So I call Mackie's answer a bit of BS. I don't see how a thin client should suffer much from the power in any modern tablet. Games are more likely to suck the life out of an ipad's hardware.
-
I'll bet that the lag is caused by making the modern PEQ to do some math. There are ways around that that would be functional and smoother without being perfect. (While being much more responsive.) Don't give up hope for a cure. I'm pretty sure there is one.
-
Is that stuff legal in Canada? The solution is trivial since all assemblers and compilers I'm aware of have had conditionals for decades. This also gets rid of unwanted bloat. Just needs two binaries and according to Apple's rules requires separate Apps. Read my lips BenO Master Fader 16 and Master Fader 32. :) Same source code base.
I certainly don't think so, but maybe if the Mackie programmers tried some of the good stuff, there might be results? Couldn't hurt. >:D Or maybe that's the reason why everything is a little off center? That original DL promo video seemed to support that. :facepalm:
-
I'm running MF3 on an ipad 2 and don't find it lacking in power. There is a bit of a lag in the channel PEQ modern, but I don't find it unacceptable. So I call Mackie's answer a bit of BS. I don't see how a thin client should suffer much from the power in any modern tablet. Games are more likely to suck the life out of an ipad's hardware.
Sorry Wynnd no lag is acceptable and on an ipad3 it's ridiculously slow, not quite so much on the mini. On MF2 they are both perfect and that's the only way you can work properly with it.
-
I'm sure glad there are so many computer literate people here. I barely understand a word of it but it sure sounds like you guys really know how to weed out the mackie inconsistencies. Makes me feel a lot better knowing they at least acknowledge the problem.
My ipad3 was no worse than the ipad 2. They both worked great on version 2.1. I think the true test will be when the new iPad air 2 shows up next week and I can see how it tracks the graphics.
I would NEVER have bought this new one strictly to use on the DL, beside being a great price, the retina display was needed for the Netflix app. Watching e bay carefully and patiently can pay off as I found this for $ 249.00
New....no refurbs or b stock. Brand new, sealed box, full warranty, free shipping.
I will report on the results after I try it. I am hoping it works since for me the PEQ is very important. As things are looking very positive this coming year I need to be up to speed. Looks like I have 2-3 bands using me for all gigs this coming year which means 5-7 shows a month.
-
You can't get a "no lag" situation. Doesn't exist. Pretty sure what you really mean is no perceiveable lag. (Humans don't notice things that occur quickly but are still lagging. Nano-seconds matter to computers.) I get the difference. I can live with things this way. It would be better fixed. Would be interesting to see the source code for the "modern PEQ". I'm betting on there being some math to calculate the position being the likely source of the excessive lag. Math can be very demanding on smaller processors. And the apparent lack of difference between the later ipads and the ipad 2 would point to the video as not being much of the reason for problems. Someone probably put some divide function call in there. If it's integer math, it's pretty fast. insist upon real math and you get great results at a much slower rate. (And being that it's calculating the entire time you're adjusting the PEQ, that's a lot of math.) I'm guessing that a 50 x 200 matrix result would be close enough for functional and with integer math that should run like a banshee.
-
You can't get a "no lag" situation. Doesn't exist. Pretty sure what you really mean is no perceiveable lag. (Humans don't notice things that occur quickly but are still lagging. Nano-seconds matter to computers.) I get the difference. I can live with things this way. It would be better fixed. Would be interesting to see the source code for the "modern PEQ". I'm betting on there being some math to calculate the position being the likely source of the excessive lag. Math can be very demanding on smaller processors. And the apparent lack of difference between the later ipads and the ipad 2 would point to the video as not being much of the reason for problems. Someone probably put some divide function call in there. If it's integer math, it's pretty fast. insist upon real math and you get great results at a much slower rate. (And being that it's calculating the entire time you're adjusting the PEQ, that's a lot of math.) I'm guessing that a 50 x 200 matrix result would be close enough for functional and with integer math that should run like a banshee.
Wynnd I'm disappointed that you followed BenO into that same rabbit hole. ;) Did Mackie change any part of the PEQ from V2.x or even 1.0 ? NO same calculations! If they had increased the resolution (which we don't even know what it is. 1/3 octave or 1/60th?? ) they would be shouting it from every rooftop as a competitive edge. That leaves two culprits AFAIK. The infamous Mandolin communications from Mackie and the graphics UI library changes from Apple. If your app doesn't play well with multicore GPU processors you're out of luck. Most of that burden fell on Apple and they made sure that most apps wouldn't suffer under the Retina display by doubling the number of GPU's and RAM. That of course leaves Mackie holding the bag with their Mandolin comm package. My vote is for Mackie.
-
Well...since I was so curious to see where the problem lies, I was able to borrow a brand new iPad air 2.
Our service techs at my "real" job use iPads to document jobs and generate invoices so I have taken one of our brand new ones home to play with for the weekend. I will be able to actually try the newest iPad myself this weekend. I'm hoping it solves the problem, even though it has to go back to its rightful owner come Monday morning.
Even if it solves the problem, it sure doesn't in my opinion relieve mackie of the responsibility to provide the app that works for everyone that made the investment in the product already. If they want to put a note on all new units that the iPad with the 64 bit architecture is needed that's up to them. They could also reput the original app that we know works back online so people have the option.
Curious as to
-
Based on what I'm reading here it looks like I'll be moving on to another product :-(
It's really too bad, as I was and have been a huge supporter of this mixer.
I have 2 iPads with 2.1 loaded, and I'm going to attempt to back everything up so that I can use these for as long as possible.
The fix for Mackie is simple, offer a Master Fader Lite version (2.1), but it's not looking like they will go that route.
-
I'm one of seveal people who have suggested that MF2 be made available, I think it was me who suggested 'MF lite' as a name. I've just posted on the DL Facebook page asking if there is a good reason why this is not possible. In my view the cost of doing MF lite would be minimal as they already have MF2 and it wouldn't ever need updating other than minor fixes for iOS version changes. If anybody wants to add a comment https://www.facebook.com/pages/Mackie-DL-Series-User/440051199417992 (https://www.facebook.com/pages/Mackie-DL-Series-User/440051199417992) it can only help the Mackoids see the sense in the suggestion.
-
I'm one of seveal people who have suggested that MF2 be made available, I think it was me who suggested 'MF lite' as a name. I've just posted on the DL Facebook page asking if there is a good reason why this is not possible. In my view the cost of doing MF lite would be minimal as they already have MF2 and it wouldn't ever need updating other than minor fixes for iOS version changes. If anybody wants to add a comment https://www.facebook.com/pages/Mackie-DL-Series-User/440051199417992 (https://www.facebook.com/pages/Mackie-DL-Series-User/440051199417992) it can only help the Mackoids see the sense in the suggestion.
3.0 has the fix for the "white noise" problem - plus probably some others. I can understand why they don't want V2 out there with those issues. If they were to do an MF Lite they'd have to do quite a bit of work to at least include the bug fixes :( . I do think that V3 is "ugly" on the DL1608 with the screens optimized for the DL32R not the DL1608. I hope they fix those issues soon...
-
I'm one of seveal people who have suggested that MF2 be made available, I think it was me who suggested 'MF lite' as a name. I've just posted on the DL Facebook page asking if there is a good reason why this is not possible. In my view the cost of doing MF lite would be minimal as they already have MF2 and it wouldn't ever need updating other than minor fixes for iOS version changes. If anybody wants to add a comment https://www.facebook.com/pages/Mackie-DL-Series-User/440051199417992 (https://www.facebook.com/pages/Mackie-DL-Series-User/440051199417992) it can only help the Mackoids see the sense in the suggestion.
3.0 has the fix for the "white noise" problem - plus probably some others. I can understand why they don't want V2 out there with those issues. If they were to do an MF Lite they'd have to do quite a bit of work to at least include the bug fixes :( . I do think that V3 is "ugly" on the DL1608 with the screens optimized for the DL32R not the DL1608. I hope they fix those issues soon...
They could just ditch the ipad channel altogether, this would be a lite version after all. Maybe they could improve the hopeless reverb at the same time.
-
I would also agree that a DL lite would be a solution as long as they make it known that the white noise problem has not been eliminated.
Most those who would revert back to that program would understand this since they have already lived this nightmare. New users buying a DL should be advised of the problem or instructed that the V-3 is best if used with the new ipad that have the better processor.
Educating the user of the possible ups and downs BEFORE they download is the critical part.
I can tell you that my preliminary test last night of the DL1608 with an Ipad Air 2 proved that the V-3 worked flawlessly with this Ipad. There was zero lag and fast opening of screens. I only used music playing thru the channels to try it.
I will be doing more extensive testing with it tonight, with mics and instruments.
-
That's good to hear. I still don't have a problem with the slight lag with either my ipad 2 or my non-retina ipad mini. For others that are bothered by the lag, a hardware upgrade should get them back on track. (Or a willingness to use only the classic PEQ.)
-
I would also agree that a DL lite would be a solution as long as they make it known that the white noise problem has not been eliminated.
Most those who would revert back to that program would understand this since they have already lived this nightmare. New users buying a DL should be advised of the problem or instructed that the V-3 is best if used with the new ipad that have the better processor.
Educating the user of the possible ups and downs BEFORE they download is the critical part.
I can tell you that my preliminary test last night of the DL1608 with an Ipad Air 2 proved that the V-3 worked flawlessly with this Ipad. There was zero lag and fast opening of screens. I only used music playing thru the channels to try it.
I will be doing more extensive testing with it tonight, with mics and instruments.
Hey Rdmitch;
I agree with you 100% And am glad that the IPad Air 2 preliminary test on MF 3.X showed no lag so far. Mackie says they're trying to tweak the software to help with the lag, but I have a very sneaking suspicion that it really won't get resolved. If there's some improvement that would be great. Gotta give them a chance I suppose. Either that or have to look around for a good deal on an iPad Air 2. :eek:
Good luck with the rest of your tests! :thu:
-
I'm one of seveal people who have suggested that MF2 be made available, I think it was me who suggested 'MF lite' as a name. I've just posted on the DL Facebook page asking if there is a good reason why this is not possible. In my view the cost of doing MF lite would be minimal as they already have MF2 and it wouldn't ever need updating other than minor fixes for iOS version changes. If anybody wants to add a comment https://www.facebook.com/pages/Mackie-DL-Series-User/440051199417992 (https://www.facebook.com/pages/Mackie-DL-Series-User/440051199417992) it can only help the Mackoids see the sense in the suggestion.
Yes - Sam - I loved your idea! I will go to their site and make the same suggestion.
-
I would also agree that a DL lite would be a solution as long as they make it known that the white noise problem has not been eliminated.
Most those who would revert back to that program would understand this since they have already lived this nightmare. New users buying a DL should be advised of the problem or instructed that the V-3 is best if used with the new ipad that have the better processor.
Educating the user of the possible ups and downs BEFORE they download is the critical part.
I can tell you that my preliminary test last night of the DL1608 with an Ipad Air 2 proved that the V-3 worked flawlessly with this Ipad. There was zero lag and fast opening of screens. I only used music playing thru the channels to try it.
I will be doing more extensive testing with it tonight, with mics and instruments.
MF2 works flawlessly on my iPad 1. I never had the "white noise" problem, nor did the other 6 people that I know locally that use the DL. We just want to keep using it the way it was, a good, solid working unit.
-
Just played around with the updated QSC Touch Mix App 2.0.23 and it works very well on my old iPad 2. No lags like MF 3.X on the same iPad. Everyone seems to be getting it right so far. Except for you know who. Lets hope the next MF update is the ticket? I'm sure they will get it working smoother.
I know MF 3.X has a lot going on, but the QSC App isn't uncomplicated from what I've seen of it either, even though it's an update too. I'm probably comparing Apples (no pun intended) to oranges, but this app (QSC) and others seem to be playing well with iOS 8.X. I did actually read your post WK to Wynnd on Jan 22. ;)
-
Maybe it's very easy to look at another company's app for 30 minutes and say that it's perfect while working with Master Fader 3.x for hours and say that the slight lag makes it totally crap. (It's not.) I suspect that the competition isn't perfect and you would have to work with it for longer periods of time to find out what bothers those users. (And I don't want anyone suggesting that products that aren't on the shelf are perfect. They're not on the shelves because the manufacturers already know that they aren't perfect yet.)
-
I certainly have never said that MF 3.X was crap. It needs a little tweaking to be sure. My comparison between 2.X and 3.X and TouchMix, were based on opening that app(s) and noticing a difference between them after 5 minutes or so. This was enough to show me that MF 3.x does have lag issues, compared to MF 2.X, which I’ve been using since it came out, with no visible lag. TouchMix responds just as fast as MF 2.1.1 on the same old iPad 2.
No app is ever going to be 100% perfect and I never expect them to be, but when an update demonstrates a visible lag in my opinion compared to the older version on the same iPad, there is certainly something going on to create it. AND when I install a competitor’s app that was just updated, on the same old iPad and it shows no noticeable lag on the same iOS and graphics, something is not quite there yet with MF 3.X. I’ve even installed the X32 app and the X-Air app, no lag or issues upon opening them up.
-
KM then let me say it that MF3.x is a cobbled together piece of crap. This has taken advertising a step too far. Greg C. had it right a while back when he predicted that Mackie would dump the DL1608 with the next product. Well here it is. How about running competitors product for a year or better without noticeable lag, would that be good enough? It's time for Mackie to address the sync, lag and bundling problem without their usual BS and other excuses. Why is it that I have two versions of VoiceRecord without a problem on my iPad? What's wrong with MF16 and MF32 as apps? It's made even simpler by Apple since all Apps are sand-boxed. I've seen decisions made like this by companies before for product differentiation and they no longer exist or got a big black eye. >:(
-
KM then let me say it that MF3.x is a cobbled together piece of crap. This has taken advertising a step too far. Greg C. had it right a while back when he predicted that Mackie would dump the DL1608 with the next product. Well here it is. How about running competitors product for a year or better without noticeable lag, would that be good enough? It's time for Mackie to address the sync, lag and bundling problem without their usual BS and other excuses. Why is it that I have two versions of VoiceRecord without a problem on my iPad? What's wrong with MF16 and MF32 as apps? It's made even simpler by Apple since all Apps are sand-boxed. I've seen decisions made like this by companies before for product differentiation and they no longer exist or got a big black eye. >:(
WK;
I have to agree with you and that this might indicate the end of support for the DL806/1608 platforms. Many people have invested a lot of money in these and it’s sad it might happen. If you are on MF 2.X you’re safe, but no more updates. If you don't want to buy a new iPad or just stay on 2.X, that is. I can live happily on 2.X since everything works as it should. It’s not the end of the world. If you don’t have a backup of 2.X you have no choice to live with a slightly squirrely DL 1608/806 IMHO.
There are many that have no issues with a slight lag etc. That's great that it's a non issue. But for some, myself included, it's an annoyance that might just mess up a show in a critical moment. And thusly not acceptable.
My local music store no longer has the DL806 on their web site and the 1608 has been discounted $200 off the list price. Is the hand writing on the wall already here? Two versions of MF would make sense. SENSE? What’s that today?
-
I think a lot of complaining goes on for fairly minor reasons. It seems very obvious to me that Master Fader 3.x is a completely rewritten app. (Which explains why it looks so different while looking familiar.) Sometimes you've got to give software developers some credit for being willing to go back to the drawing board. Pretty sure Mackie will eventually figure out someone made a real math call when an integer call would have been more appropriate. (For calculating location to display the PEQ token. That is a probable explanation for Modern to have the lag and vintage to not.) Of course, maybe Mackie figured out the white noise was caused by integer math calls to the processor. I don't know, but integer math has been around since the very first computers.
-
I agree that it’s a total rewrite. But a lag, whether it’s not a big deal for most, is for quite a few here and out in the real world. It should be as responsive as 2.X. Nothing like trying to move a fader real fast in a panic, for some reason and it doesn’t hit the bottom until after your finger does. Or since you only use modern EQ for all your gigs and seeing and hearing your EQ change after you’ve physically changed the curve on the graph.
These things should all work within a reasonable amount of time, like following your finger very closely instead of a mile behind it. There was a minute (miniscule) lag with 2.X, but there is a noticeable lag with 3.X. Of course digital/virtual faders cannot compare to moving a real fader, but 2.X was pretty darn close in my opinion.
I would’ve jumped on 3.X and all its new features even for the DL1608. They’re great. But I’m glad I am able to stay on 2.X indefinitely. When the update comes out, I will be testing it on one of my iPads. If there’s no improvement, 2.X it is.
This is all based on perception as to what is a lag and what isn’t a lag. For some, no issues, but for quite a few there’s a perceived lag that should be and “eagerly hoping” that it will be addressed soon. Like I’ve said ad nauseum, I can happily go on in ignorant bliss using MF 2.X until the DL dies, but I am concerned for those here and elsewhere that are stuck with 3.X on the 806/1608 platforms who cannot go back.
I hope BenO and Mackie are watching and listening. Yes, I know that BenO said they are working on a “lag” cure, but I am not holding my breath. I do however have my fingers crossed for a quick solution. :)
-
Really Wynnd, I know you want to throw yourself on that Mackie sword every chance you get but this is extreme. Just use iPad File Explorer or something comparable and look at the forbidden fruit. I know Jobs didn't want his users to hurt themselves but the files tell a lot. V2.1.1 that I currently have is made up of 823 files and a handful of folders. Some date back to V1.1 which was the first usable version issued Nov 15 2012. Most are png files (yes a raster display) with about 790 png files. Don't like something in the graphics load it into Photoshop or other graphics editor, change it and put it back into the iPad. ;) The last release V2.1.1 was issued Feb 18 2014, actually finished on Feb 12 a Sunday. Since it took 16 months to get to V2.1.1 I highly doubt it's a "complete rewrite" in 9 more months. A quick look at the files tells all. As I suspected Mackie downloads the images into the DL including uLinux the Shark code (DSP) and the Black/App (bet they had fun with that) for the Blackfin ARM CPU. That math theory needs to go, really white noise issue or lag? KM still think it's a rewrite?
-
Really Wynnd, I know you want to throw yourself on that Mackie sword every chance you get but this is extreme. Just use iPad File Explorer or something comparable and look at the forbidden fruit. I know Jobs didn't want his users to hurt themselves but the files tell a lot. V2.1.1 that I currently have is made up of 823 files and a handful of folders. Some date back to V1.1 which was the first usable version issued Nov 15 2012. Most are png files (yes a raster display) with about 790 png files. Don't like something in the graphics load it into Photoshop or other graphics editor, change it and put it back into the iPad. ;) The last release V2.1.1 was issued Feb 18 2014, actually finished on Feb 12 a Sunday. Since it took 16 months to get to V2.1.1 I highly doubt it's a "complete rewrite" in 9 more months. A quick look at the files tells all. As I suspected Mackie downloads the images into the DL including uLinux the Shark code (DSP) and the Black/App (bet they had fun with that) for the Blackfin ARM CPU. That math theory needs to go, really white noise issue or lag? KM still think it's a rewrite?
When you get under the hood like you have, it does make sense. In my limited computer knowledge I do understand your explanation. Obviously to keep a very familiar look, they would use previously designed files. Then edit existing ones and layer new ones for the different look. Complete rewrite? Probably not. So what’s causing the perceived lag with the graphics? Too many graphics files to handle by a slower CPU/GPU and 512MB system RAM? (iPad 2) More system intensive features that affects the older iPads?
-
Sure is a lot of discussion over this issue. Wish I new more about how and what makes these type of programs work, but like many
others I just use the app and mixer and want it to work like it always did before. Why it doesn't work the way it should is kind of irrelevant to me.
I only want them to fix the problem, but I also understand that it's not an overnight process.
Again, I reiterate that the lag and other delay issues are FAR from making the product un usable. As many of us have
found the work around to allow us to function with the V 3.01 app.
I did take the 1608 with the ipad air 2 for a dry run on Saturday night. Just a practice for one of the bands I mix for. Plugged in 6 vox mikes,
3-4 instrument mikes and had absolutely no problem. Didn't mess with drum mikes for this test. Not only did the 1608
perform just like in the "old days", but the retina display livens up the display a bit. I left my regular Ipad 3 locked onto the board and just used the Air 2
as a remote. I had to return the borrowed Ipad air this morning, but am waiting for one I ordered on line.
I doubt I will upgrade the 1608 with the lightning adaptor or air tray.
-
Sure is a lot of discussion over this issue. Wish I new more about how and what makes these type of programs work, but like many
others I just use the app and mixer and want it to work like it always did before. Why it doesn't work the way it should is kind of irrelevant to me.
I only want them to fix the problem, but I also understand that it's not an overnight process.
Again, I reiterate that the lag and other delay issues are FAR from making the product un usable. As many of us have
found the work around to allow us to function with the V 3.01 app.
I did take the 1608 with the ipad air 2 for a dry run on Saturday night. Just a practice for one of the bands I mix for. Plugged in 6 vox mikes,
3-4 instrument mikes and had absolutely no problem. Didn't mess with drum mikes for this test. Not only did the 1608
perform just like in the "old days", but the retina display livens up the display a bit. I left my regular Ipad 3 locked onto the board and just used the Air 2
as a remote. I had to return the borrowed Ipad air this morning, but am waiting for one I ordered on line.
I doubt I will upgrade the 1608 with the lightning adaptor or air tray.
Thank you for posting your test results with the iPad Air 2. :thu: Most informative for myself and I'm sure, others here. So it looks like the new iPad is the ticket if you want to have MF 3.X run like good ole MF 2.1.1. Unfortunately, for me an iPad Air 2 is out of the question right now and I'm sure for some here as well. Let's hope Mackie will eventually straighten things out.
-
OK, so we've established that the ipad2 and original mini are slow, the ipad3 is hopeless and the Air2 works fine. Can we fill in the gaps? Anybody using mini 2 and 3, ipad 4 and air to give us their experiences?
-
OK, so we've established that the ipad2 and original mini are slow, the ipad3 is hopeless and the Air2 works fine. Can we fill in the gaps? Anybody using mini 2 and 3, ipad 4 and air to give us their experiences?
I agree. Enquiring minds would certainly like to know. ;)
-
One more comment. When I built my first bass, building a second neck for it was much easier than fixing the issues with the first neck. To some degree programming is like that. Unless Mackie brought in a brand new team, rewriting MF 3.x might be easier than fixing the white noise problem.
Also think that testing MF 3.x in the store with an iPad might let you know what your use experience will be. Does Apple let you install free App Store apps on their display iPads?
-
Also think that testing MF 3.x in the store with an iPad might let you know what your use experience will be. Does Apple let you install free App Store apps on their display iPads?
I would think that if you were serious in buying one from them in the Apple Store, they should. I mean, how long would it take to delete the app from the display model? 5 seconds or less? In the real world? Probably very unlikely. :)
-
it's funny you should ask about trying the app at the APPle store. The chances are no.
About 2 weeks ago I ventured into the friendly local Apple store with exactly that intension. Before I started searching on e bay I wanted to know if it would be a fix. After waiting for the privilege of being helped I proceeded to explain to the salesperson what I needed to do. He said they do not have the ability to download any apps in the retail store. Best suggestion was I could buy it, set it up right there in the store, load the app, try the app.
If did not work they would simply return the unit and void the transaction. I took a pass on that deal, since I was looking more on eBay or craigslist. I did however buy a cable I needed while I was there.
The next day, I get a survey in my email from the Apple Store asking me to rate the service. I did my best to be as nice as possible while still explaining the dissatisfaction of not being able to load the app to try.
a day goes by and I get a call from the Apple Store regional mgr. to discuss why my rating was less than stellar.
it might have been the comment about the sales person being more qualified to work at Apple...bees
we chatted a bit and he did reiterate that all the apps in the store are actually broadcast by apple from a remote office and they really can't download apps at the store.
Explaining to him why I needed to do this he seemed to feel it was all due to the processor architecture.
in thinking about this, I guess I can compare it some of our computers at work. they always worked fine doing their job, we could run all our programs including AutoCad which is pretty intense graphics. Now here comes BIM
which is 3 D building modeling with unreal graphics and guess what.....our computers just ain't got the balls to run it right . Slow as molasses. computers got updated to meet the needs, not by choice but by necessity. My guess is the new V.3 added so much with the overview screen, groupings and other new features that it just can't run on the old processor. The new pads have the 64 hz processor to run the retina display and that gives it the oomph, to handle 3.1
now I'm sure not saying we need to run out and buy iPads, cause that won't happen. we either live with the lag, hope they come up with a solution that will work with the old architecture which probably won't happen without giving up something else
Just think Mackie must have known about this or did not do a thorough job testing the program on older iPads.
They should have discovered it before us end users found it out the hard way. This is why I feel they OWE us the option to go back to V-2.
Just keep in mind a iPod air is about $400 on e bay (display model, refurbs, used). You can sell an older iPad for 150-200 making the fix about $200.00 net. I sold an old ipad gen.2 16g for 150.00 this weekend.
-
Rdmitch;
I kinda figured that, having never tried that at the Apple Store here. But thank you for sharing your experience. At least Apple was on the ball by following up with you in such a quick manner. Nice. I've always found Apple very helpful.
Mackie may just come up with a solution to this issue. Just have to be patient I guess. And it would be smart for them to either allow us to go back and or 2 versions of the app like WK suggested. I'm just ticked that there are a lot of people in the same boat right now. Stay on 2.X if you can, live the lag and wait for a solution, or upgrade your iPads. Ebay is looking interesting right now. ;)
-
if your not storing tons of music and apps, a 16g is plenty for mf3 and costs less to buy. Plus the chances of finding one used on eBay are better.
-
if your not storing tons of music and apps, a 16g is plenty for mf3 and costs less to buy. Plus the chances of finding one used on eBay are better.
The 16 GB iPad 2 I use docked has 2500+ songs on it.
-
if your not storing tons of music and apps, a 16g is plenty for mf3 and costs less to buy. Plus the chances of finding one used on eBay are better.
The 16 GB iPad 2 I use docked has 2500+ songs on it.
There's a very slight chance you'll run out of tunes. ;)
-
Just got the iphone 6 with 64 GB. Putting most of my music there and leaving the ipads for practice music and OnSong along with Master Fader.
-
Just got the iphone 6 with 64 GB. Putting most of my music there and leaving the ipads for practice music and OnSong along with Master Fader.
Nice. :thu: 64GB? That should be enough storage, hopefully. :laugh:
-
Not sure if I could put all of my music on there, but I've done a lot of stuff for my Annual Senior's variety show and there are a lot of clips, karaoke, and sound effects on my MacBook as a result. (This is year number 9 for me.) There really is so much crap in itunes that attempts to seriously clean it out might take hours or days. I liked my iphone 4S and have kept it to be a monitor mix control. (Whenever Mackie releases My Fader 3.x) I like the 6. Setup for fingerprint ID and while I've setup Apple Pay, I have yet to use it. (Mostly use my debit card from the Credit Union.) And I can control my hearing aides from it as well. I'm starting to setup location specific hearing aide settings. We have a number of restaurants that we frequent and the restaurant setting really kills off the background white noise. Basically when we get close to a setup location the hearing aides change settings. Pretty functional and wasn't available on my ipad mini and the hearing aide app didn't work at all on my 4S. (Makes more sense with a phone that you generally keep on the body whenever you're wearing the hearing aides.) The only issue I'm having with it is that when I make a call it wants to broadcast straight to my hearing aides. My hearing loss in all in the high frequencies and that is nearly unintelligible as there are no lows. Gotta figure out a way to lock that out. (Might be one of those things that others might be asking for too.) Should look for an appropriate forum for that. That's enough rambling for this morning.
-
Wynnd:
It’s absolutely fantastic that we can use this technology to make our lives better. But we sometimes have to jump through hoops to get it to that point. But it is getting better and easier, I think. The hearing loss in my left ear is a bit more than my right, but for the most part I can get by without hearing aids. And it’s all high frequencies too. I haven’t done anything about my hearing, I think, out of pride. A guy thing. Never wore earplugs back in the days. We were just to cool and never thought we'd have problems in our late 40's and on. Tinnitus started in my 40's Now pushing 60 and kicking my own behind. :facepalm:
I am waiting for hearing aids that can make sound as good and as perfect real ears do. I don’t know if that’s possible and it may take a lot longer to happen, maybe not in my lifetime, though. I guess some research is required on my part. It’s so cool that you can use a smart phone to work with your hearing aids. Wow. And by the way you’re not rambling as far as I’m concerned. Very interesting and very close to home too. :thu:
-
Looking for a little help. It appears that both of my iPads (2 and 3) were updated to Master Fader V3.0.1 when I wasn't looking. Tried using it, but... So anyway today I turned on my iPad mini and lo and behold it still has version 2.1.1 on it. How do I go about downgrading my DL1608 and the other two iPads?
-
Looking for a little help. It appears that both of my iPads (2 and 3) were updated to Master Fader V3.0.1 when I wasn't looking. Tried using it, but... So anyway today I turned on my iPad mini and lo and behold it still has version 2.1.1 on it. How do I go about downgrading my DL1608 and the other two iPads?
This is my post on going about downgrading. Read this first. Then you will have a back up of MF 2.1.1 stored in iTunes on your computer and can down grade your other iPads too. (delete MF 3.X from them first)
http://cacophony.aspinock.com/index.php?topic=795.0
Then you can dock the mini or regular iPad with MF 2.X to the DL, either directly or using an adapter cable.The DL will then do a firmware "update" to match the version of MF (2.1.1 in this case) on your iPads.
Read the whole topic, there's a lot of good stuff from other forum members there too.
I hope it's not too confusing for you? My fingers are crossed for you! :)
-
Thanks! Worked perfectly 8)
-
Thanks! Worked perfectly 8)
You are more than welcome. Excellent!
-
OK, so we've established that the ipad2 and original mini are slow, the ipad3 is hopeless and the Air2 works fine. Can we fill in the gaps? Anybody using mini 2 and 3, ipad 4 and air to give us their experiences?
I posted this last week and no one has replied with any info. Is everyone running older ipads like me? I would love to know how MF3 runs on a 4 or an air as I'm going to have to upgrade my 3 soon if things don't change.
I intend to stick with MF2 for work but i updated my ipads to MF3 to see how bad things were. Interestingly they finally managed to update MF in my itunes when I wasn't paying attention, so I thought I'd do a search on my mac for master fader. I have 3.0.1 in itunes/mobile applications and the trash, 2.1.1 where i tucked it away for safety and in the trash and 1.3 in itunes/itunes media/mobile applications, thats a lot of faders!
-
OK, I'm running an ipad 2 with 16 GB and also an early ipad mini. (non-retina display) I'm running Master Fader 3. Yes there is a noticeable lag in the channel PEQ modern mode. I don't consider this a major problem. I've seen bad lags in other programs running on very marginal hardware and this isn't it. I also don't do much with the PEQ during a gig. The faders on the other hand get used quite a bit and I don't see any lag there. I wouldn't go back to MF 2.1.1 even if I could. (And I've got enough backups of my computer which backs up my ipads to actually do that.) There are a few screens in MF3 that I don't use and consider unnecessary, but others might find them useful. Overall, I like the update and it works for me on my current ipads just fine. And for those screaming it's unusable because of the lag, either they're experiencing something much worse than I am or they are just looking for something to complain about.
-
OK, I'm running an ipad 2 with 16 GB and also an early ipad mini. (non-retina display) I'm running Master Fader 3. Yes there is a noticeable lag in the channel PEQ modern mode. I don't consider this a major problem. I've seen bad lags in other programs running on very marginal hardware and this isn't it. I also don't do much with the PEQ during a gig. The faders on the other hand get used quite a bit and I don't see any lag there. I wouldn't go back to MF 2.1.1 even if I could. (And I've got enough backups of my computer which backs up my ipads to actually do that.) There are a few screens in MF3 that I don't use and consider unnecessary, but others might find them useful. Overall, I like the update and it works for me on my current ipads just fine. And for those screaming it's unusable because of the lag, either they're experiencing something much worse than I am or they are just looking for something to complain about.
Wynnd you don't have an ipad3 otherwise you would change your opinion. It is catastrophically slow on the modern eq but also at changing pages (around 2 seconds but more the first time you open them), the original ipad mini is not so bad but bad all the same. The thing is I was worried before buying the 1608 that the lack of faders and buttons would be unacceptable. This proved not to be the case as the app was so responsive. This is no longer true.
-
So you are experiencing something much worse than I am. On the other hand, if someone built an attachable or bluetooth fader rack for it, I'd buy it in a heartbeat. I see the advantages of physical faders and there are many times when I want them. (That allows me to keep my eyes on the stage while easily keeping my fingers on the faders. Something very hard to do with virtual faders.)
Understand that I was asked about my experience with particular ipads and replied for myself. (And not anyone else.)
-
pytchley;
Like I've mentioned here quite a few times, to many I'm sure, annoying, I have/had the same lag issues that you're experiencing on my iPad2's. I'm back to 2.X as well. Much smoother running all around. I also would like to find out if MF 3.X runs better on the 4 or original iPad Air. I did check the specs for the Air, (not 2) and it has an A7 CPU and more system memory than the iPad 2 (1GB DDR3 VS 512MB). So theoretically it has a better chance out of the gate to run MF 3.X like it should. Does it?
I like you hope there's someone here or lurking that will chime in on this one who has the Air (1) the 4 and any mini's with the same specs as the Air 1.
-
According to the Apple guy I talked to last week, the iPad air has the 64 bit processor which is much faster for graphics and the A7 chip is superior to the old iPads and minis. Don't really know the difference from the A7 to the A8 chip that is in the iPad air 2.
I would be interested to see how folks with the iPad original are doing, been watching for replies to the post asking for input from users of different iPads.
-
I have to say that it seems odd that MF3 may be more processor hungry than MF2, all the heavy duty stuff goes on inside the DL. The berry app works fine on my iPad 2 and 3 and it has far more going on than MF3 so it can be done. The A&H apps are also slick and effectively lag-less, even the iLive one which has double what the X32 has and four times the capability of the DL1608.
-
I have to say that it seems odd that MF3 may be more processor hungry than MF2, all the heavy duty stuff goes on inside the DL. The berry app works fine on my iPad 2 and 3 and it has far more going on than MF3 so it can be done. The A&H apps are also slick and effectively lag-less, even the iLive one which has double what the X32 has and four times the capability of the DL1608.
I mentioned the exact same thing pretty much on page 8 of this post. It's weird for sure, if the "other apps" have no issues on the older iPad 2 and 3. But MF 3.X seems to tax the resources, either the DL or the iPad or both. I have a slight feeling that we're all going around in circles, speculating on this. The only one(s) that can theoretically answer this is BenO and Mackie.
And it appears that even though they say they recognize there’s a problem and they are working on a fix in the next update of MF 3.X they are being quite silent on the reason for the issues. I’m sure this is either to cover their behinds or they don’t really and truly know why MF 3.X as they stated really requires a faster iPad CPU and more system memory to run as it should.
Too bad the hardware side of the DL806/1608 couldn’t benefit from a “Ready Boost” feature like Windows. Just plug in a reasonably large SD Card, say 16GB and voila, the DL now runs like lightning. Never going to happen though. Just wishful thinking on my part. 8)
-
I'll throw my 2 cents in. 8)
I'm using the iPad Air 2 (64Gb) with MT 3.0.1, and have no problem with lag. The response is perfect. So far, I've no issues with it.
-
Yesterday did an other gig
Using an ipad2 didnt notice any lag anymore, dont know what i did different .
So also ipad2 with no or very low lag
-
Yesterday did an other gig
Using an ipad2 didnt notice any lag anymore, dont know what i did different .
So also ipad2 with no or very low lag
That's encouraging! :thu:
-
Curiously as to what you may have changed since many others who th iPad 2 have the problem. Myself included.
-
ios just had an update to 8.1.3 Might be the answer? (Will look at my ipads and see if the lag has vanished.) Just checked my ipads. The mini is updated and no change for me, but remember that either I'm not experiencing as much lag or I'm just not bothered by the slight lag there is. My ipad 2 is updating right now. Will let you know if anything changes.
-
Let us know what you find
I have a show tonight so I sure won't mess with anything today !
-
I didnt update to8.1.3 yet
But in the past i had already lots of lag ,next time almost no lag, then again lag again and so on
Must be some thing in the setting that i changed but dont know what
Or on the othr hand can be the mackie ghost playing arround, lol
-
I didnt update to8.1.3 yet
But in the past i had already lots of lag ,next time almost no lag, then again lag again and so on
Must be some thing in the setting that i changed but dont know what
Or on the othr hand can be the mackie ghost playing arround, lol
"Ghosts in the Machine?" shades of iRobot. ;)
-
It's the new Apple secret spyware designed to make us all go buy new iPad airs
-
I think they all work faster if you don’t look at them! :facepalm: Just going to have to learn to mix without looking at the screen. They hear your thoughts too. :eek:
-
Just a reminder to always "force close" all apps and then reboot right before a gig. There's a FAQ about all that and more here someplace ;) ...
-
Just finished updating my older iPad 2 to iOS 8.1.3. The iPad is a shade faster overall. I ran MF 2.X on the update and it worked fine, just as before. I then updated to MF 3.X. It opened as fast as 2.X. The fader lag seems to be a little less than before on iOS 8.1.2. Not as fast as MF 2.X still. But it’s pretty much useable now, for myself.
Vintage EQ, which I use exclusively was just fine, like 2.X. Modern EQ, is still atrocious IMHO. When you open up the different functions at first, there is a slight delay. When you close them and open them again right away, they are fast. Maybe loading up into memory?
For myself, I feel that I could now use MF 3.X under iOS 8.1.3 fairly comfortably in a live situation. Overall the iOS update has made MF 3.X generally a little faster on my older iPad 2. I may try it on my newer iPad 2 to see if there is a difference. Probably not though. I still may wait and hang onto MF 2.X, to see if Mackie makes any improvements to the next update of MF 3.X
-
Not quite the same situation. I don't expect to have to upgrade the ipads that I bought at the same time I bought the mixer (iPad3 and original mini). It's going to become impossible to stay with MF2 in the long run since it is no longer available for any new ipad added to the system. I tried contacting Mackie about what i consider to be an unacceptable situation and got the following reply from BenO:
As you know, Master Fader v3.0 adds a ton of new UI features. This requires more CPU processing from the iPad. Unfortunately, this means that some older iPad including iPad 2, iPad 3 and iPad mini will operate slower on graphic intensive screens like mixer view, overview and the EQ. These devices are already got slower with iOS8 than with iOS7 for the same reason. For the best performance, we recommend an iPad Air or iPad mini 2 or newer.
The iPad 3 has the same CPU as the iPad 2, but because it is Retina, has 4 times as many pixels to process. So screens that require CPU intensive tasks will be slower on the iPad 3 than the older iPad 2 and iPad mini. The EQ view is the most CPU intensive screen as you make changes since the iPad needs to recalculate the EQ curve. Thus the iPad 3 EQ has the slowest response to changes.
We are looking into if there are any more performance optimizations that can be done. The EQ screen in particular is on the top of our list and is being improved for the next update.
I hope this helps.
Ben
Here's hoping!
Hi pytchley;
I wrote Mackie on the 26th with the same questions as you and got this reply today. Look familiar? I honestly didn't copy your letter, but it sure looks like it, except the last line in bold.
As you know Master Fader v3.0 adds a ton of new UI features. This requires more CPU processing from the iPad. Unfortunately, this means that some older iPad including iPad 2, iPad 3 and iPad mini will operate slower on graphic intensive screens like mixer view, overview and the EQ. These devices are already got slower with iOS8 than with iOS7 for the same reason. For the best performance, we recommend an iPad Air or iPad mini 2 or newer.
The iPad 3 has the same CPU as the iPad 2, but because it is Retina, has 4 times as many pixels to process. So screens that require CPU intensive tasks will be slower on the iPad 3 than the older iPad 2 and iPad mini. The EQ view is the most CPU intensive screen as you make changes since the iPad needs to recalculate the EQ curve. Thus the iPad 3 EQ has the slowest response to changes.
We are looking into if there are any more performance optimizations that can be done. The EQ screen in particular is on the top of our list and will be improved in an update we are just about to submit to Apple.
Ben
Does this mean there's a ray of hope?
-
That's brilliant, I liked that.......Thanks
-
That's brilliant, I liked that.......Thanks
You're certainly welcome. I thought you might be interested.
Didn't have to work too hard to come up with a customized letter at all. :facepalm: Copy and Paste is wonderful. :P
-
In the meantime try the following to see if performance increases.
Navigate to Settings > General > Accessibility > Reduce Motion. Tapping on Reduce Motion will open up another screen with a toggle switch. By default, the circle will be placed on the left side of the oval. Just tap on the circle to switch it over to the right side, thus turning the oval green and reducing motion. This turns off the parallax effect.
And to get rid of that glassy look.
To do this, open up the Settings app and navigate to General > Accessibility > Increase Contrast > Reduce Transparency and turn this feature on.
It may help but since I don't have MF3 loaded I can't try and no I don't have time to load and unload MF.
Still has buggy WiFi and Bluetooth.
-
In the meantime try the following to see if performance increases.
Navigate to Settings > General > Accessibility > Reduce Motion. Tapping on Reduce Motion will open up another screen with a toggle switch. By default, the circle will be placed on the left side of the oval. Just tap on the circle to switch it over to the right side, thus turning the oval green and reducing motion. This turns off the parallax effect.
And to get rid of that glassy look.
To do this, open up the Settings app and navigate to General > Accessibility > Increase Contrast > Reduce Transparency and turn this feature on.
It may help but since I don't have MF3 loaded I can't try and no I don't have time to load and unload MF.
Still has buggy WiFi and Bluetooth.
I already had motion reduced, maybe it's the default? Reduced transparency. No discernable difference in MF3. Thanks for trying....
-
I'll give those tips a go to see if they work on my older iPad 2 too! Couldn't hurt! Thanks WK. :thu:
Oh, I know this has probably been beaten to death, but please forgive my aging brain cells. Does the upgrade to MF 3.X cause issues with AirPlay at all? Since I use it mostly all the time, this is very important. I haven't been able to test it with the school's DL in a live situation. Still comfortably on MF 2.X for now.
I couldn't remember if that particular issue had been resolved on the forum. Please be kind? Any info would be greatly appreciated. 8)
-
In the meantime try the following to see if performance increases.
Navigate to Settings > General > Accessibility > Reduce Motion. Tapping on Reduce Motion will open up another screen with a toggle switch. By default, the circle will be placed on the left side of the oval. Just tap on the circle to switch it over to the right side, thus turning the oval green and reducing motion. This turns off the parallax effect.
And to get rid of that glassy look.
To do this, open up the Settings app and navigate to General > Accessibility > Increase Contrast > Reduce Transparency and turn this feature on.
It may help but since I don't have MF3 loaded I can't try and no I don't have time to load and unload MF.
Still has buggy WiFi and Bluetooth.
Gave your tips a go and alas, no significant improvement. Oh well. But once again, thank you for the suggestions though. They are appreciated. :thu:
-
I upgraded my ipad 2 and saw no difference, but when I shut off Multitasking Gestures, there was a solid improvement. Seems to me that was one of the suggestions for improved performance with an earlier Master Fader.
-
I upgraded my ipad 2 and saw no difference, but when I shut off Multitasking Gestures, there was a solid improvement. Seems to me that was one of the suggestions for improved performance with an earlier Master Fader.
Its actually in the RTFM ;) .
-
Think you should be meaning the Manual. RTFM is what you tell people who want you to explain everything so they don't need to read the manual. That said, I obviously read the entire manual when I purchased the mixer in Sept 2013. I've skimmed a lot of manuals recently. MF 3.x manual, Toyota Sienna manual. (Got a new car after our other Sienna got totaled. No one hurt.) I'm pretty good at finding information when I need to find it. (And remember that the PEQ lag doesn't bother me at all.)
-
Ok so I found an unrecoverable hour to install MF3.01 on iOS7.1.2 just to see for myself what all this slowness was about. Compared to 2.1.1 it is slightly slower on Modern EQ. This is on a iPad 3 with iOS7.1.2. Tested both offline and online which added maybe a bit more delay but it was hard to tell. This is not as slow as the U-tube demo demonstrated. I use a pen anyways and did not get the overshoot. Reading the scales is another story, in short it sucks. Then there's someones bad joke at Mackie with the overview screen, really faders without control!! Defeats the whole purpose, what a waste of time. >:( While I was there I looked at the files on the iPad and there has been a major consolidation of PNG files. The raster screen building blocks. Now at about 90 instead of the 790 previously. That's UI changes to accommodate the DL32r or otherwise known as DL3214. Some interesting other observations to be posted on another topic stay tuned. Current draw is up a bit by about another 150 mA. Blackfin code is triple the size ? iOS 8.x will probably make the response even slower but I'm not going there yet.
Correction the png files are there and more (not 90) just now in sub-folders.
-
Think you should be meaning the Manual.
That's what I said, the "Really Terrific Friendly Manual" ;) .
-
Ok so I found an unrecoverable hour to install MF3.01 on iOS7.1.2 just to see for myself what all this slowness was about. Compared to 2.1.1 it is slightly slower on Modern EQ. This is on a iPad 3 with iOS7.1.2.
That's interesting, my lamentably slow ipad3 (cellular 16) is on ios 8.1.2, never had ios 7 as I was on ios 6 when I updated to MF3. Could this be most of the the problem? Might as well try 8.1.3, nothing to loose. Why the hell can't we backtrack on os's like on a computer?
-
RTFM means Really Terrific Friendly Manual?????? I used to do computer support and that's not what we thought it meant. I have a T-shirt with it on it. My Wife and I used to joke, that it's not a career, it's a wardrobe. (We attended so many user groups. Linux, Windows, Internet, Novell...... Seemed like there was a meeting twice every week.) Eventually certified as a CNA for Netware 4.11 and had an A+ too, but that seems years ago. (Bailed on IT in May 2000. Guess it has been a while.) While I don't mind messing with computers, I don't ever want to do it as an occupation ever again. Way too stressful for my tastes. (And seeing that I'm about 3 months short of being able to collect Social Security, it is just not something I would even consider now.)
-
One more try respectfully...
I know this has probably been beaten to death, but please forgive my aging brain cells. Does the upgrade to MF 3.X cause issues with AirPlay at all? Since I use it mostly all the time, this is very important. I haven't been able to test it with the school's DL in a live situation. Still comfortably on MF 2.X for now.
Would anyone mind answering my possibly redundant question? I would be most grateful. 8)
-
Ok, one thing always seems to lead to another. Tried airplay (ipad3/8.1.2/MF3/latest Airport express) on music app but no airplay icon, no airplay. Then tried livetrax (my theatre music/fx player). Airplay icon,tapped it and airplay works OK. Then switched back to Music app which I hadn't quit, still no icon for airplay but it's working. So there's half an answer for you.
-
Ok, one thing always seems to lead to another. Tried airplay (ipad3/8.1.2/MF3/latest Airport express) on music app but no airplay icon, no airplay. Then tried livetrax (my theatre music/fx player). Airplay icon,tapped it and airplay works OK. Then switched back to Music app which I hadn't quit, still no icon for airplay but it's working. So there's half an answer for you.
Thank you. :thu:
So it works sort of, kind of, with some messing around with it. I still have MF 2.X so will keep newer iPad on it and play around with 3.X on the older one. Won't connect it to the DL. Will see if the next update cures this and other "non" issues. From BenO's letter to me and I quote: "an update we are just about to submit to Apple." end quote. I hope it's soon. ;)
-
RTFM means Really Terrific Friendly Manual??????
Why, what did yous guys think it meant? ;)
-
RTFM means Really Terrific Friendly Manual??????
Why, what did yous guys think it meant? ;)
Roadranger's Taking the F**king Mickey?
-
For all of us digital mixer owners/operators: Reboot The Freaking Machine N'est Pas? ;)
-
Roadranger's Taking the F**king Mickey?
;)
-
Much to my chagrin, :-[ I finally found the topic on AirPlay, iTunes and AirPort Express. I've read all the posts. Please forgive an old mind and I can safely say this has been answered in more than triplicate. Thank you all who originally posted this. 8)