Author Topic: Editing audio from DL32r - redux  (Read 969 times)

JohnMHoyt

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Editing audio from DL32r - redux
« on: February 22, 2018, 05:26:56 PM »
Instead of responding to the original thread where we discussed this, I started a new one...

This being - how the DL32R breaks up your recorded sessions into multitrack wav files, with X number of tracks embeded in one multi-track .wav that might be 8 minutes for 26 inputs, or 12 for 18.....  And how a typical gig of mine has 50-120 minutes per set, so I have multiple multi-wav files...

TOH2002 created a marvelous graphical frontend to SOX that has helped me so much... 
read here http://cacophony.aspinock.com/index.php?topic=1344.msg16834#msg16834

But now, I am finally going to buy a new DAW and trying to figure out which one I can get that is going to natively let me work with these files.

I want to shorten my time invested by avoiding using the audio demuxer (sorry TOH2002, it's been fun, but I need to simplify!)

What are you guys currently using?

Pro Tools and Adobe Audition are the front runners right now... I've used both (own an old copy of audition).

I'm dying to be able to click on one of these multitrack files and it open the whole series up, so I have a whole set......

ToH2002

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Re: Editing audio from DL32r - redux
« Reply #1 on: February 22, 2018, 10:23:23 PM »

But now, I am finally going to buy a new DAW and trying to figure out which one I can get that is going to natively let me work with these files.

I want to shorten my time invested by avoiding using the audio demuxer (sorry TOH2002, it's been fun, but I need to simplify!)

Hey, no hard feelings  - glad I could help for some time.

Unfortunately, I don't see a DAW that can do exactly what is needed out of the box. None that I know will let you work directly with multichannel WAV files - you'll need to split them up into individual channels before doing any further work. A number of DAWs will let you open multi-track WAV files directly and then split them up for you, so no problem there. Cubase can automatically split a multichannel wav file into individual channels on dragging them into the arrangement; Reaper has a function to "explode" multichannel files into individual channels. Haven't found the corresponding function yet in Studio One, so can't say if that will work there.

But what they all won't do automatically is:
  • concatenate your time-sliced recordings into one long sequence
  • combine stereo pairs into stereo tracks

You can work your way around the first one by enabling "snap-to-object" and just dragging the individual snippets of your recording behind each other on the timeline, but it's still a hassle. And you want to be absolutely sure the slices align with single-sample precision.

The second is even more of an issue; depending on the DAW you'll have to jump through a number of hoops to combine two mono tracks to a true stereo track; in all cases, it requires rendering the two mono files to a new stereo WAV file. In Protools, this is a somewhat simple drag-and-drop operation; other DAWs will have you work harder for your stereo files...

So even though I do own a number of DAWs that can import multi-channel wave-files, I still built Audio Demuxer to deal with these two issues. Thats' why I'm not sure if you want to let go of Audio Demuxer just yet...

Cheers,

Torsten


JohnMHoyt

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Re: Editing audio from DL32r - redux
« Reply #2 on: February 22, 2018, 10:30:58 PM »

Hey, no hard feelings  - glad I could help for some time.
...

Unfortunately, I don't see a DAW that can do exactly what is needed out of the box.

See, that's how you get people...  You make something that works very well...  And I do mean VERY WELL. I use it a couple times a week.
And then, when they try to get off your crack product, you tell them "you'll be back"..

Guess I'm not going anywhere then....    Good thing you don't charge per usage.  I'd owe you hundreds by now if it were just a dollar.

I was laughing at how easy Audacity is to create a true stereo track by linking them, then when you render it mixes stereo....    ProTools and Audition don't even work that well.

Welllllll  crud..  I was hoping I was going to move along and save myself some time.....
I spent about 2 hours today trying to get Audacity to take wav1 and bust it into individual tracks and append wav2 to those. I could not do it any way I tried.
Got frustrated.

Sighhhhhhhhhh

Thanks again for the tool I use all the time.

l

James91104

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Re: Editing audio from DL32r - redux
« Reply #3 on: February 23, 2018, 12:15:18 AM »
Reaper and Studio One can natively separate and display BroadcastWave files.

JohnMHoyt

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Re: Editing audio from DL32r - redux
« Reply #4 on: February 23, 2018, 02:59:25 AM »
Reaper and Studio One can natively separate and display BroadcastWave files.

It’s not the separation that I need, it’s that combined with adding the next series to the end of the first group.

I’m dealing with up to 32 recorded tracks, covering sessions from 50 minutes to an hour and a half typically, but up to 3 hours sometimes...... split into a handful to a dozen multitrack files.

Currently I can do load ONE multitrack into audition or audacity, but cannot do the next part

Drumrolls

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Re: Editing audio from DL32r - redux
« Reply #5 on: February 24, 2018, 07:00:28 PM »
I find Reaper is great. I am not sure what you mean by work on them natively so sorry if I am off topic.

When importing the files into Reaper you can select all the files from the show and it will ask if you want to import them into a single track which you do and the once that is done you select them all and explode to multi track. Presto your whole multitrack show there in front of you.

JohnMHoyt

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Re: Editing audio from DL32r - redux
« Reply #6 on: February 24, 2018, 07:30:27 PM »
So if I have a folder with 1.5 hours of continuous recording, it is broken up in to file1.wav, file2.wav, file3.wav.......

Reaper will let me import just file1 and it will import allll the other files and append each one to each individual track automatically?
I've never seen it do that....   What step am I missing?

Drumrolls

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Re: Editing audio from DL32r - redux
« Reply #7 on: February 24, 2018, 10:08:31 PM »
So off the top of my head... Only recently discovered it...

You open a new project and when you import the file rather than just importing  file 1 you select ALL the WAV files you want to bring across. When you click import them it will give you an option of importing them all to a seperate track or to a single track.
 Choose the single track option.

This will give you all the wave files nicely up against one another.

Highlight the whole track, then I think it is in item processing, choose to "explode to multi track"

Done.... You have the whole show in seperate multi tracks flowing smoothly into one another.

Mix and you have a great sounding show...

dpdan

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Re: Editing audio from DL32r - redux
« Reply #8 on: February 25, 2018, 03:08:19 AM »
I use a completely different approach, since I too think the time and hassel of this Multi-channel WAV is a royal pain in the....

After I get back to the studio after a recording job, I connect a CAT5 cable from the Dante port on the rear of the DL32R and connect the other end to my Mac Pro desktop Ethernet port and open Digital Performer (DP) and open a new project with a template that I created named... DL32R 32 track transfer. For most people who do not have a Dante card in the rear of their DL32R, you can just as easily use the USB connection instead of Dante.

I use the routing page in Master Fader to route all 32 USB channels to Dante 1-32.
DP has 32 mono input channels with Dante 1-32 assigned consecutively. Hit record in DP and then play on the multi-track recording in Master Fader and let it play in real time,
once the concert is over I have a 32 track DP project ready to edit, mix etc.   

Before I purchased the DC16 Axis control console and Dante card, I used a MacPro laptop with DP recording the USB port on the rear of the DL32R, that way I did not have to be bothered with this multi-channel wav file crap.
It was convenient to get home and have a DP project with the audio ready to go. But now, conveniently, I no longer need the laptop, I use a very small SSD drive connected to the DL32R's USB port and then transfer the audio as described above.   

The luxury of just hitting record in Master Fader is priceless. 
« Last Edit: February 25, 2018, 03:18:04 AM by dpdan »

JohnMHoyt

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Re: Editing audio from DL32r - redux
« Reply #9 on: February 25, 2018, 03:52:37 PM »
So off the top of my head... Only recently discovered it...

You open a new project and when you import the file rather than just importing  file 1 you select ALL the WAV files you want to bring across. When you click import them it will give you an option of importing them all to a seperate track or to a single track.
 Choose the single track option.

This will give you all the wave files nicely up against one another.

Highlight the whole track, then I think it is in item processing, choose to "explode to multi track"

Done.... You have the whole show in seperate multi tracks flowing smoothly into one another.

Mix and you have a great sounding show...

OMG - I've used Reaper for certain little jobs for years, since a friend of mine first told me about it (it was just in alpha/beta testing at the time) and I have NEVER known about that functionality.

In short, it works very well...   Now I have to learn how to get the effects to work the way I want them to and then I may be able to automate just about every show with my band.

I'll try to update with my findings........

THANK YOU....

JohnMHoyt

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Re: Editing audio from DL32r - redux
« Reply #10 on: February 25, 2018, 03:59:44 PM »
I use a completely different approach, since I too think the time and hassel of this Multi-channel WAV is a royal pain in the....

After I get back to the studio after a recording job, I connect a CAT5 cable from the Dante port on the rear of the DL32R and connect the other end to my Mac Pro desktop Ethernet port and open Digital Performer (DP) and open a new project with a template that I created named... DL32R 32 track transfer. For most people who do not have a Dante card in the rear of their DL32R, you can just as easily use the USB connection instead of Dante.

I use the routing page in Master Fader to route all 32 USB channels to Dante 1-32.
DP has 32 mono input channels with Dante 1-32 assigned consecutively. Hit record in DP and then play on the multi-track recording in Master Fader and let it play in real time,
once the concert is over I have a 32 track DP project ready to edit, mix etc.   

Before I purchased the DC16 Axis control console and Dante card, I used a MacPro laptop with DP recording the USB port on the rear of the DL32R, that way I did not have to be bothered with this multi-channel wav file crap.
It was convenient to get home and have a DP project with the audio ready to go. But now, conveniently, I no longer need the laptop, I use a very small SSD drive connected to the DL32R's USB port and then transfer the audio as described above.   

The luxury of just hitting record in Master Fader is priceless.

Interesting take on it...  I had done similar with the USB port a couple times to get it into a DAW, but could not do that often because the one DL32R resides in a rack case that stays in the vehicle most of the time, and it's just a LOT of work to bring it in, set it up and go, then to wait 2-4 hours to get it loaded in the DAW would be painful.
The benefits - it would be in a native show format...  It would have the proper time stamps (My DL32's time is off by months - making it hard to find the session files if I just copy them)

JohnMHoyt

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Re: Editing audio from DL32r - redux
« Reply #11 on: February 25, 2018, 07:57:08 PM »
Reaper may just be perfect for my needs.  Will continue playing with it, but so far, the primary features I need are being taken care of...

Imported last night’s24 tracks, append them to one another to make one continuous show, then “explode” into 24 separate tracks I can manipulate - check

Added a 25th track, called it “VOX reverb” and added REAverb to it with a suitable setting and set 4 vocal tracks to send to the verb track - check

Added compressor directly to bass drum subkick/moon mic - check

Added plate-like verb directly to snare - check

Mixed nicely...   

Have not saved a track yet or mastered yet, but so far... so good.

Appreciate the info that got me started!


Weogo

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Re: Editing audio from DL32r - redux
« Reply #12 on: February 26, 2018, 02:26:54 AM »
Hi John,

Glad you brought this up!

Torsten, I have been very happily using your Demuxer before opening files in Reaper.

Drumrolls, thanks for posting this!
Initially, with the track highlighted by mousing over, the 'explode' function was grayed out.
Going to Edit, Select All Items, etc.  made the 'explode' function usable.
(This was with a Win7 computer.)

Thanks and good health,  Weogo

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Re: Editing audio from DL32r - redux
« Reply #13 on: February 26, 2018, 05:45:03 AM »
Happy my limited knowledge on this came in useful for you guys.

ToH2002

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Re: Editing audio from DL32r - redux
« Reply #14 on: February 26, 2018, 11:14:33 PM »
Great that the Reaper solution works for you guys! I fiddled around with Reaper's "explode" for some time before starting work on AudioDemuxer. What always threw me was the fiddling necessary to combine some of the exploded channels back to stereo for my stereo recordings.

I have a number of stereo pairs in my mixer setup for keyboards and e-Drums. I want to treat them as stereo while mixing, so I need stereo wave files. This is the key reason why I created AudioDemuxer - it gives me the "profiles" option to set up a mix of mono and stereo channels as I like them, so I just run my rehearsal or live recordings through and simply drag all the resulting files into a pre-configured session in Reaper, Cubase or Studio One.

If you don't need this capability and you have only mono channels from your DL32, then I'd absolutely recommend Reaper - it's a  super-versatile DAW by a great development team - and probably the most configurable one!

Cheers,

Torsten