Live Performance & Production > Sound Reinforcement

How many of you think you can hear FOH from the stage? Really?

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Harpman:

--- Quote from: Rdmitch on August 07, 2015, 03:00:19 PM ---Totally agree that you can not determine FOH from stage.
Aside from doing sound for numerous bands, I also play in two bands. We have this
discussion regularly about a sound person and I always get tired of fighting the battle
So...last week when playing a show, I just let the band set the sound from stage and play, I went ahead and put a nice little digital recorder about 30' out front and let it run.  After the show when I listened back and let them
hear the terrible mix of the vox and guitars.  They got to hear that a bad vocal harmony would have
been pulled way back by a good sound person. 
Hopefully I made my point and never will need to justify using a FOH person again

--- End quote ---

That recording along with a large club might do the trick for me  ;D.  My issue now is a drummer that doesn't know how to play softly indoors.  We play at a venue that has hard surfaces.  Behind him is a concrete wall.  It's funny, I mentioned to him about playing lighter and he joked and said "Drummer's can't play light".  I beg to differ. So he said, "Take my kick and overhead out of the mix".  I told him at the last gig I muted both his channels.  So my issue is 1. Drums get loud. 2. Bass, guitar come up so they can hear themselves. 3. The only thing that is going thru the PA is vocals and keys, so they get buried in the mix. 4. I get audience coming up to me saying they can't hear the vocals or keys, so I match the keys with the rest of the instrumentation and bring the vocals about 3-5 db's higher. 5. Then they say it's too loud. 

This happens to be a fine dining establishment with a lounge.  People come to have casual conversation and listen to music, as long as they don't have to scream at each other.  I'm tired of telling the band that the stage is too hot and they need to come down.  They turn down and turn right back up.  I'm going to have a little powwow with the band before tomorrow's gig. Drummer has to play with light sticks, bamboo sticks, something!!  Very frustrating  :(

Rdmitch:
As a drummer for over 50 years I can say with total certainty that he can play softer.
Lighter sticks, and a bit of control will help. Many drummers feel the need to play hard because the energy is something we desire. Just like guitarist like to crank it up in order to get the needed overdrive and tone.

Why not have him put a acrylic screen in front of the drums and a panel behind him to get rid of the concrete reflectivity. Especially at a fancy restaurant where volume is critical. I often put something in front of guitar amps to block the sound a bit.  Maybe offer to help pay for the screen from band proceeds  since it helps insure future gigs for the whole band. There is nothing a sound tech can do to stop a player they have no control over. Got to nip it in the bud now in a diplomatic way explaining its for the betterment of the whole band.

The recording proved my point to the non believers who now see the light of a tech to help out. I am even willing to train someone's kid or wife on how to run the board. Unfortunately I had to pretty much tank the gig to make my point. Playing,  knowing how terrible the mix was was not the highlight of my week.

jneau:
I totally leave the mix in the hands of our mixing dude.  Complete trust in him.

My only struggle has been getting decent tone from my 40w Blues Deluxe at a volume that lets him do his job properly.

troy mcclure:
I totally know I can't mix from the stage but I do every week.  In the bar band business there is no budget for a sound guy.  I am set it and forget it kind of guy.  I use the presets on the DL 1608 as a starting point , I hired a sound guy to come set us up at venue we play often and I base every thing off that setup. I very rarely touch the board except for volume and monitors at different locations.   Is it perfect, no but it is the only solution we can afford.
My band is one of the few bands in the area that does not try and blow peoples eardrums. 

Harpman:

--- Quote from: Rdmitch on August 07, 2015, 08:51:57 PM ---As a drummer for over 50 years I can say with total certainty that he can play softer.
Lighter sticks, and a bit of control will help. Many drummers feel the need to play hard because the energy is something we desire. Just like guitarist like to crank it up in order to get the needed overdrive and tone.

Why not have him put a acrylic screen in front of the drums and a panel behind him to get rid of the concrete reflectivity. Especially at a fancy restaurant where volume is critical. I often put something in front of guitar amps to block the sound a bit.  Maybe offer to help pay for the screen from band proceeds  since it helps insure future gigs for the whole band. There is nothing a sound tech can do to stop a player they have no control over. Got to nip it in the bud now in a diplomatic way explaining its for the betterment of the whole band.

The recording proved my point to the non believers who now see the light of a tech to help out. I am even willing to train someone's kid or wife on how to run the board. Unfortunately I had to pretty much tank the gig to make my point. Playing,  knowing how terrible the mix was was not the highlight of my week.

--- End quote ---
He actually did play lighter this time  :). We have such little room on stage that an acrylic screen is near impossible.  At this gig, there are no proceeds.  My GF (lead singer) and I take nothing and pay the band  :(

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