DL32R vs X32Rack

[Kev tyler]

I won't be buying one, just curious, the reverbs on the dl range have had some absue on boards like this, mackie did not mention anything in the vids about new reverbs did they?

Kev

[robbocurry]

We'll have to wait and see. The DL verb is usable, not the best, but far from the worst. I can live with it but then I'm not a fan of my mixes "swimming" in fx.
Maybe mf 3.0 will bring something new to the 1608 version.
They've answered a lot of the other user requests so maybe this will get a look too.

[pytchley]

I too only know one X32 owner and his has failed three times in a little over a year. I'm very happy with my DL, nearly two years now, lots of varied gigs, zero problems except the white noise one with ipad 3 which is no deal breaker for me. Incidentally no white noise problem with ipad mini with apple 30 pin to lightening connector as reported elsewhere.

.

[ijpengelly]

I occasional do work for a guy who runs an LS9 as his main desk and for smaller gigs had been using a DL1608 (can't recall if he still has it) and just purchased an X32Rack, which he is going to show me around next time I am up his way, when I am hoping to get a feel for whether I like it or not. I have faffed around with the interface and don't find it all that great, which spoils it for me since that is ultimately what you are working with as your primary control. Much of what attracts me to the DL32R is the simplicity, with a decent amount of processing to do the majority of what can reasonably be expected with it. If I did more big venue gigs I would be tempted by the Presonus and a nice big touch screen PC.

In terms of reliability, I have used a variety of gear over the years and whilst some of the behringer stuff has been of lower build quality I have not had any significant failures (compressors, EQs, feedback destroyers, crossovers, desks and speakers), likewise for the majority of the Mackie gear I have had, the only thing I have seen fail are the older powered speakers which have been overdriven and caused the amp to fail, so probably not relevant here. There are risks with a lot of gear and a lot of it comes down to how you handle (transport and store) it.

[Keyboard Magic]

My next laptop has to have a touch screen.  My current MacBook Pro has all sorts of finger prints on the screen where I tried to use the non-existant touch screen.

  Yes, much to my chagrin, I've been told once or twice at shows from crew, when I have both laptop (Windoze non touch) and iPads, that the stylus won't work on the laptop. And there are some finger prints on it. 

[WK154]

He was the .01%er

Sam good choice and you won't regret it, mine has been flawless since I received it last year. I use it in a studio environment but all my other "B" mixers are  without failures, it offsets that 0.01%.

[robbocurry]

He was the .01%er

Sam good choice and you won't regret it, mine has been flawless since I received it last year. I use it in a studio environment but all my other "B" mixers are  without failures, it offsets that 0.01%.

Lol.

[lightguy48]

Here is my $.02 on the X vs DL argument.  I own a DL1608 and have mixed quite a few shows on the X32 Compact and full size X32.

Like others have commented I have not heard of any widespread X32 issues. Behringer made a significant investment in R&D and manufacturing upgrades to produce the X32 series.  It is NOT the 'old' Behringer QC that used to be the brunt of so many jokes.  I have heard of a few issues, an occasional post about a console rebooting during a show, obviously not good, but I've never heard of one outright dying and it's certainly never happened to me.

I like my 1608, it's a good mixer, however, I dislike the effects, they sound cheap, the inline power supply, primarily the coaxial power plug, is a weak point and I really dislike the lack of recallable preamps, switchable phantom power on individual channels, and if you have a low gain mic that requires a high gain setting you can hear the LED's clicking as they flicker with audio.  I also hate not having selectable pre/post aux settings on each channel instead of the whole bus (MF 3.0 fix??)

I am looking for a step up from my DL1608 for bigger shows. When I look at the DL32R I see virtually nothing in it that makes it a superior mixer to the X32 series, even the X32 rack.  As has been pointed out for basically $100 more than the DL32R you can have an X32 Rack with an S16 add-on or buy a pair of X32's for just a hair more and have two for smaller shows and ganged together for 32 inputs on a big show.

The effects on the X32 are so much better than the DL series it's not funny and there are a lot more available. The routing is vastly superior, including send options, you have numerous RTA options, you have many more DCA's and subgroups, you have PC control and management capability via network, not just USB, and the USB to drive feature really isn't that big of a thing for me.

Plus you have control surface options.  Last year I mixed 12 bands in two nights for a large festival.  I could have mixed on my iPad using my 1608 but when you get wild and crazy band/set changes the iPad is just too restrictive, I want faders, buttons, and switches that I can grab quickly and easily.  I still used my iPad on stage to set monitor mixes but I had a full FOH setup for when the band  was performing because I need to make adjustments much more quickly than I could via an iPad constantly swiping around.
 
Something I forgot to credit Mackie with, I do think their iPad UI is one of the better ones out there, easy to navigate, when I do use an X series mixer I miss the ability to swipe left-right compared to using blocks of channels

[Kev tyler]

Here's my two pence worth

If i was doing gigs with a 32 channel desk, I would imagine these would be pretty important and well paying events, not like open mic at the dog and earwax tavern, there is no way I would purchase hardware that is currently soley reliant on ios,

I have some great apps on my pad for playback, every time IOS auto updates , the behaviour of these apps changes drastically and not always for the better, you would have to have a pretty regimented approach to working if this was your bag, of course you could switch updates off and use that 500 dollar euro whatever pad for nothing but live mixing, you now own a 3000 dollar desk, let's add a grand for two dedicated non updatable pads!

Or let's suggest Separate  boot hard drive for your pcs with all the old versions of iOS on and the old versions of your apps  and settings backed up, what a pain in the bum, at a gig the band leader or sound  tech says,  oh my pad has died lend me yours and I will just put this app on.....NO WAY   Would be my response

I am sorry, but if there is a pc application to control the macke kit, it should have been distributed even in its rough form by now in order for them to get the feedback of guys like you at the earliest instance.

Drifting again

For goodness sake I look at that beautiful design and wonder why isn't there a slide out drawer to install a 2. 5 hard drive, I guess security freaks like me will make do with the Velcro strapping?

Kev

[robbocurry]

IMHO, this is a pointless discussion.
Until the DL32R and MF3.0 are out, these pie in the sky comparisons are just a waste of time.
Even when it's out, comparisons will still be pointless.

People will buy it.
Some people will buy the x32 rack.
Other people will buy the A&H iDR 32 or Presonus or whatever.

One product doesn't have to desist for the other to exist.
Mackie will have their market share and Behringer theirs.
Coke or Pepsi, Apple or Microsoft, virtual or real faders, cheap or premium - we all have our preferences.

Some people here will want to see this and Mackie fail, but I'm not one of them.

[lightguy48]

I don't think the discussion is pointless, we know Beno is watching the threads so this is a good way to get some feedback regarding what other people desire and why they look at other products.

I'm not slamming Mackie, I really like my 1608 but it's not a one size fits all product.

I think it's a little productive to point out some of the reasons the DL32R doesn't appeal to me over some of the X models.

Now here is a really good suggestion for Mackie that even people on the Behringer forums have suggested:

Build a control surface for the DL32R and I'll buy it!   The reason I'm not interested in the DL32R currently is because I'm stuck using my iPad.  If you had a remotable control surface, via WiFi or Ethernet that gives you all of the control with dedicate buttons, faders, switches, etc but it's just controlling the mixing engine via Ethernet I would be highly interested. 

If and when I ever buy an X32 product it would be with an S16 because I don't want to lug a heavy snake around, I just want a single Ethernet cable (S16 to X32 or WiFi access to a control surface from the mixing engine)

[Kev tyler]

I have suggested a few times on here that a physical controller could encapsulate an iPad or a phone like a clam shell and  offer protection and a rugged physical controller surface. 8 faders  or increment wheels , and a next button for the next group of channels, a cut out so you can use the touch facility of the i device inside,

You guys have not even had the decency to even rip my ideas apart., apart from wykd bloke to be fair.

Come on guys, what do you think?

Kev

[RoadRanger]

I also hate not having selectable pre/post aux settings on each channel instead of the whole bus (MF 3.0 fix??)

Yah, a pet peeve of mine too. In particular I need to run things like the reverb sends for the snare, overhead and horns pre-fader. Right now I'm running the 'verb pre-fader as a work-around. I really would like two 'verbs too, then maybe I could live with "all pre or post", one each .

[sam.spoons]

I have suggested a few times on here that a physical controller could encapsulate an iPad or a phone like a clam shell and  offer protection and a rugged physical controller surface. 8 faders  or increment wheels , and a next button for the next group of channels, a cut out so you can use the touch facility of the i device inside,

You guys have not even had the decency to even rip my ideas apart., apart from wykd bloke to be fair.

Come on guys, what do you think?

Kev

Given the way iPad touch screens work I can't see how a physical overlay would operate. Take faders only, I suspect you have to have the contact pad touch the screen when you press the fadercap but then if the fader cap moved when you pressed it it might miss the V-Fader on the screen. Also how would you swipe the fader bank (and note that when you do swipe the fader bank it doesn't default to a fixed position for the visible faders, you can have half a fader showing). Sorry KT, you did ask 

[Kev tyler]

I have suggested a few times on here that a physical controller could encapsulate an iPad or a phone like a clam shell and  offer protection and a rugged physical controller surface. 8 faders  or increment wheels , and a next button for the next group of channels, a

Kev

Given the way iPad touch screens work I can't see how a physical overlay would operate. Take faders only, I suspect you have to have the contact pad touch the screen when you press the fadercap but then if the fader cap moved when you pressed it it might miss the V-Fader on the screen. Also how would you swipe the fader bank (and note that when you do swipe the fader bank it doesn't default to a fixed position forhe visible faders, you can have half a fader showing). Sorry KT, you did ask 

Hi buddy

This is not what I am suggesting, not an overlay, you Dock the pad to a slate or clam shell, the slate has a rechargeable battery to avoid pad drain, it keeps the pad charged too. Did I mention the big rubber antenna that improves wi fi range?

It connects via the Lightning port, you get a free old style adaptor thrown in free, not 50 dollars Ben if you are listening,

Instead of touching the screen, a row of 8 non latching toggle switches are semi permanently routed to the first 8  Software faders, I will include a nudge  button to quickly shift to 9 to 16 , 17 to 24  or you can swipe the screen and decide if you want  that group to be controlled by your pointer finger or the mechanical buttons etc, if you like you can have 2 active groups at once one on screen one on the slate,  these do not need to be huge faders, they are the spring type toggle switches , you push them forward and backward but they revert to the middle position, so no false adjustments, I am suggesting we abandon the pointy finger gesturing and use this device in the natural position, the fore fingers of both hands supporting the unit from below, all adjustments made with the thumbs, so less rsi risk, so when you are in one edit screen let's say fx, you get the use of the pad touch edit, but the physical buttons are still tied to the last group of 8 you last edited, you get the option if you touch a physical button for the iPad screen  to jump back to the fader view to show the change or not, of course you can toggle the groups of 8 to control all the other stuff, but there will be a dedicated master fader increment switch , fx level switch echo level switch and I am toying with adding a reverb mute button which is mirrored to a physical outlet on the slate for guitarists and such to mute fx, talk whilst still playing a song with a ..... Get this whacky idea. A fooswitch  People who don't think this is enough will love the second version, this holds 2 pads, back to back, when you want to stick on a certain page like fx and iems and compressors but still want the direct fader access, you just flip the whole thing over.

I hope one of the clever guys somewhere takes this idea and runs with it and remembers that it was me who offered this gift to the world free of charge, makes a load of cash and pays me something?

Thanks for the feedback sam, your years of experience is priceless can I add you to my coming soon mail shot?

Oh by the way

How does

WUNDA SLATE

sound?

Kev