switching between House and Monitor mixing

[Weogo]

Hi Beno, other Mackie Folks and Users,

I really like the DL1608 and DL32R.
They have the features I need for the mixing I do, and I find the tablet interface mostly very useful.

I have mentioned this before, here is a detailed description:

I commonly mix House and Monitors on one mixer, with one Ipad, and my number one request is to make this easier.
On the DL32R I commonly double-assign one preamp to two channels, one for House, one for Monitors. 
Other than shared gain, this gives two completely separate channels  ~  basically separate House and Monitor mixers. 
Commonly 1~16 are House, 17~32 are Monitors, and the four Return channels cover two-track playback, talkback mic, etc.

Right now, to go from the LR House mix to a Monitor mix I have to:
Tap the LR button, then tap select an Aux, then tap the View Group section, then tap Monitor channels.
To get back to the House mix I have to tap the Aux button, then LR, then View Group section, and House channels.
That is EIGHT taps to go in, adjust maybe one monitor fader, and get back to the House mix.

SOLUTION:
A) The MASTER FADER V2 app had the House L/R mix and all Auxes visible and selectable on the screen all the time.
It would be great to have this as an option in a V4 app update. 
B) In addition to single-tap select of an Aux it would be great if selecting LR automatically selected only channels assigned to LR, while
selecting any Monitor mix would again only select channels assigned to that Aux. 

This setup would take only TWO taps to adjust an Aux fader:
One press to select Aux-1(or any other Aux) would select that Aux AND the channels assigned to it, then adjust Monitor fader,
then one press to select LR AND be back on House mix channels.

Even for folks using one channel for House and Monitors, having the L/R and all Auxes visible all the time would mean faster access.


Users  -  am particularly interested to know if anybody else would find my suggestion useful?

Beno  -  with the DL32Rs processing power, is the above possible?
Note that I would pay for such an upgrade.  Master Fader Pro?
I know folks, a slippery slope I am suggesting...

Thanks and good health,  Weogo

[ToH2002]

Hmm, interesting idea.

I would suggest a solution that could be realized purely within the app (no need for any modification or additional processing power within the DL32R):

Give the app the option to "remember" the last used view group for each mix and automatically recall it on selecting a mix. So, when activating LR, MF would automatically activate the last used view group for LR (for you: FOH channels), switching to Aux 1&2 (InEars) would select a different view group (all channels, including drum overheads), and switching to Aux 3 (Drums Wedge) would switch to another different view group optimized for mixing drum monitors. This could all be realized purely within the app on the iPad (a simple variable that tracks selected view group per mix) - in fact, this is nothing you would _want_ to be stored within the DL32R, since other users (musicians) might actually want to use different view groups with the respective mixes.

But let me make a different suggestion (albeit a somewhat more extravagant one): get a second iPad! Makes a world of difference to be able to keep the main mix open on one iPad all the time and do monitor mixing, channel editing, FX editing, tempo tapping,  etc on a second one. You can get a used previous-generation iPad at reasonable prices these days...

Alternatively: get your musicians some Mini iPads or Touch iPods and have them do their own monitor mixes. Nobody knows my monitor needs as well as I do - unless I have a dedicated monitor tech who knows exactly when to pull the drums in my InEars and when to raise some percussion mic that I only need during the intro of one song. But I haven't had that luxury yet, so our tech person mainly focuses on FOH and is extremely happy that some of us mix our own monitors (especially for InEars). Monitors mostly get a static mix at sound check, with some adjustments in breaks (or when someone frantically waves his hands at his ears during the gig )

To me, this is the charm of the DL32R: you are not bound to ONE control surface - you can have as many as 10!

Cheers,

Torsten

 

[dpdan]

Torsten,
I agree with your post and I also understand the desire of Weogo.

A second iPad is the best, I don't use two iPads but I do use the iPad for FOH and my iPhone for monitors,,, but not always.
The DL32R now allows up to 20 iPads, iPhones or iPods. A combination (total) of 20 wireless devices.

 

[MrDOS]

I, too mix FOH and monitors, but do don't split up the channels as you describe.
In my experience, once the monitors are "dialed in," I rarely make adjustments for the rest of the night, with the possible exception of lead singers running out of gas.

At my last gig, I did run two iPads, and it was a wonderful experience, especially for quick effects changes.

[Weogo]

Torsten,

Brilliant!
I really like your idea of mixes remembering assigned faders!
This would make the Mackie Fader View feature EXTREMELY useful!!
And if Mackie goes back to having all the mixes lined up on the right with singe-tap access, this would be one tap to get to a monitor mix with the correct faders showing, and
another tap to get back to LR and house faders!!!
Even for those not double-assigning channels, this would be a very useful, simple step that would also speed things up.
I would say patent this idea, but the cat is already out of the bag.
This deserves more exclamation marks ! ! ! !        : -)

Currently I have three Ipads, four if I steal my wife's!
Basically all the Ipads are for when I'm providing for multiple shows, with my DL1608 in another venue, etc., and
for redundancy with the Mackies  -  no working Ipad, no mixer adjusting.
I believe this could be a pretty straight-forward setup and would like to see it all work on one Ipad. 
Occasionally a band has an Ipad with the Master Fader app that wants to do their monitors and I'm fine with this.
For my summer soft-seat concert series I am literally sitting out in the hall mixing and really don't want to have a second Ipad in my lap.(The spare is under my seat.) 

I have been looking at some other mixer apps.
) A&H QU has all mixes lined up on the right, next to the LR Master fader, with single-tap access, like Master Fader V2 did, for a total of four taps to get in to a monitor mix, adjust a fader and get back to LR.
) Yamaha TF is the same as A&H.
) Presonus is one tap to get in to Monitor mixes, another tap to select a particular mix and a third tap to go back to the LR mix.  Add in a couple slides to get to the channels needed.  It can show 12 faders at once.  Can the Presonus really NOT solo a channel??  I couldn't find this...
) Soundcraft is four taps plus at least a couple swipes, call it six taps.
) Behringer X32 is five taps.

Dan,
I have offered my spare Ipad to a few bands to do their own monitor mixes.  Not a one has accepted my offer.
More bands carrying Ipads that actually know how to do good monitor mixes would be great.

MrDOS, 
Great that you need only a few monitor changes!
I am often starting shows with minimal or sometimes no sound check and monitor mixes requiring fine-tuning, while I'm also getting the house mix going.

Thanks and good health,  Weogo

[stevegarris]

Another reason why I still prefer 2.x Classic!

[sam.spoons]

Me too....... I keep looking at MF3 and 4 then think "no, I know MF2 almost inside out" 5 years ago I would have killed (metaphorically) for the features MF Classic has .

I need to learn the berry app next anyway and MFC is great up to 16 channels

[gerenm63]

I have offered my spare Ipad to a few bands to do their own monitor mixes.  Not a one has accepted my offer.
More bands carrying Ipads that actually know how to do good monitor mixes would be great.

So far, I'm only working with one band that's doing their own monitor mixes (in-ears). In that band, each band member has their own iPhone. The band members handle their own mixes, and I handle FOH, with occasional monitor assist (for when they're hands are busy and they need a quick tweak -- eye contact, expressions, and finger signals still work with me). It's a fantastic way to work! I, too, wish more bands would do it. If I could afford it, I'd buy a half-dozen iPod touches or iPad Minis to hand out during the gigs.

[sam.spoons]

I'm thinking along those lines for my X32 rig with cheap 'droids as handouts...... Old iPhones would work too but they're not so cheap....

[Fluddman]

I've been letting some band members control their own monitor mix for a few years now. Unfortunately I find that even the very disciplined musos eventually give in to 'more me' syndrome and keep turning the monitors up until they squeel - usually this is accompanied by a 'it wasn't me' expression.

Cheers

[Wynnd]

This isn't a problem with IEMs.  But I can see it happening.  I hate loud. 

[beno]

Some great ideas here guys. We have had similar conversations ourselves to how best to improve this workflow. It's definitely an area we can improve and there is no processing limitation that would prevent any of this. Obviously I can't say when we will get to this as there are a lot of things we are working on, but workflow is very important to us so any way to speed it up is always high on our list.

[Weogo]

Hi Beno,

Thanks, this is great to hear!

Anything I can do, please let me know.
And am sure others here would be happy to help.

Good health,  Weogo

[gerenm63]

I'm thinking along those lines for my X32 rig with cheap 'droids as handouts...... Old iPhones would work too but they're not so cheap....

This is where it would be really nice to have the app available on Android, too (as much as my Android experiences have been utter shite). Beno? Beno? (tap tap tap ... is this thing on?)