DL32R vs X32Rack

[Jkowtko]

I have suggested a few times on here that a physical controller could encapsulate an iPad or a phone like a clam shell and  offer protection and a rugged physical controller surface. 8 faders  or increment wheels , and a next button for the next group of channels, a

Kev

Given the way iPad touch screens work I can't see how a physical overlay would operate. Take faders only, I suspect you have to have the contact pad touch the screen when you press the fadercap but then if the fader cap moved when you pressed it it might miss the V-Fader on the screen. Also how would you swipe the fader bank (and note that when you do swipe the fader bank it doesn't default to a fixed position forhe visible faders, you can have half a fader showing). Sorry KT, you did ask 

Hi buddy

This is not what I am suggesting, not an overlay, you Dock the pad to a slate or clam shell, the slate has a rechargeable battery to avoid pad drain, it keeps the pad charged too. Did I mention the big rubber antenna that improves wi fi range?

It connects via the Lightning port, you get a free old style adaptor thrown in free, not 50 dollars Ben if you are listening,

Instead of touching the screen, a row of 8 non latching toggle switches are semi permanently routed to the first 8  Software faders, I will include a nudge  button to quickly shift to 9 to 16 , 17 to 24  or you can swipe the screen and decide if you want  that group to be controlled by your pointer finger or the mechanical buttons etc, if you like you can have 2 active groups at once one on screen one on the slate,  these do not need to be huge faders, they are the spring type toggle switches , you push them forward and backward but they revert to the middle position, so no false adjustments, I am suggesting we abandon the pointy finger gesturing and use this device in the natural position, the fore fingers of both hands supporting the unit from below, all adjustments made with the thumbs, so less rsi risk, so when you are in one edit screen let's say fx, you get the use of the pad touch edit, but the physical buttons are still tied to the last group of 8 you last edited, you get the option if you touch a physical button for the iPad screen  to jump back to the fader view to show the change or not, of course you can toggle the groups of 8 to control all the other stuff, but there will be a dedicated master fader increment switch , fx level switch echo level switch and I am toying with adding a reverb mute button which is mirrored to a physical outlet on the slate for guitarists and such to mute fx, talk whilst still playing a song with a ..... Get this whacky idea. A fooswitch  People who don't think this is enough will love the second version, this holds 2 pads, back to back, when you want to stick on a certain page like fx and iems and compressors but still want the direct fader access, you just flip the whole thing over.

I hope one of the clever guys somewhere takes this idea and runs with it and remembers that it was me who offered this gift to the world free of charge, makes a load of cash and pays me something?

Thanks for the feedback sam, your years of experience is priceless can I add you to my coming soon mail shot?

Oh by the way

How does

WUNDA SLATE

sound?

Kev

The general idea of having a hard control surface that encapsulates the iPad as its touch screen definitely has merit.

Many digital consoles today are just that -- except reversed -- they are traditional digital consoles with hard control surfaces, that have a touch-screen on them for UI control that are better handled by touchpad gestures.

This is no different, except that the "brains" are in the display.

Very creative idea.  I bet we'll see one within a couple of years.

[sam.spoons]

I have suggested a few times on here that a physical controller could encapsulate an iPad or a phone like a clam shell and  offer protection and a rugged physical controller surface. 8 faders  or increment wheels , and a next button for the next group of channels, a

Kev

Given the way iPad touch screens work I can't see how a physical overlay would operate. Take faders only, I suspect you have to have the contact pad touch the screen when you press the fadercap but then if the fader cap moved when you pressed it it might miss the V-Fader on the screen. Also how would you swipe the fader bank (and note that when you do swipe the fader bank it doesn't default to a fixed position forhe visible faders, you can have half a fader showing). Sorry KT, you did ask 

Hi buddy

This is not what I am suggesting, not an overlay, you Dock the pad to a slate or clam shell, the slate has a rechargeable battery to avoid pad drain, it keeps the pad charged too. Did I mention the big rubber antenna that improves wi fi range?

It connects via the Lightning port, you get a free old style adaptor thrown in free, not 50 dollars Ben if you are listening,

Instead of touching the screen, a row of 8 non latching toggle switches are semi permanently routed to the first 8  Software faders, I will include a nudge  button to quickly shift to 9 to 16 , 17 to 24  or you can swipe the screen and decide if you want  that group to be controlled by your pointer finger or the mechanical buttons etc, if you like you can have 2 active groups at once one on screen one on the slate,  these do not need to be huge faders, they are the spring type toggle switches , you push them forward and backward but they revert to the middle position, so no false adjustments, I am suggesting we abandon the pointy finger gesturing and use this device in the natural position, the fore fingers of both hands supporting the unit from below, all adjustments made with the thumbs, so less rsi risk, so when you are in one edit screen let's say fx, you get the use of the pad touch edit, but the physical buttons are still tied to the last group of 8 you last edited, you get the option if you touch a physical button for the iPad screen  to jump back to the fader view to show the change or not, of course you can toggle the groups of 8 to control all the other stuff, but there will be a dedicated master fader increment switch , fx level switch echo level switch and I am toying with adding a reverb mute button which is mirrored to a physical outlet on the slate for guitarists and such to mute fx, talk whilst still playing a song with a ..... Get this whacky idea. A fooswitch  People who don't think this is enough will love the second version, this holds 2 pads, back to back, when you want to stick on a certain page like fx and iems and compressors but still want the direct fader access, you just flip the whole thing over.

I hope one of the clever guys somewhere takes this idea and runs with it and remembers that it was me who offered this gift to the world free of charge, makes a load of cash and pays me something?

Thanks for the feedback sam, your years of experience is priceless can I add you to my coming soon mail shot?

Oh by the way

How does

WUNDA SLATE

sound?

Kev

Ah, that would be more like it but, as you said earlier, sounds expensive. I think utilising existing tech would be cheaper so, basically, exactly what you suggest but with a dock for an iPad and a midi fader pack (BCF2000, Korg Nano Control or WHY) That way you're using existing (and cheap with the Korg and Berry BCF) tech in a new way. Good stuff that man 

BTW, "years of experience"? Are you suggestion I'm old? 

[lightguy48]

Now that's a cool idea!   Yes, if you could make the control surface an extension of the iPad, much like numerous peripherals that are available for tables from GPS modules to mic inputs for RTA's on tablets.

I like the idea of the iPad or other tablet being a form of control surface but down below you have physical faders to mix on!  Maybe a few encoders that can be swapped around via the ipad touch screen for EQ, Gate, Compressor, etc...

Cool concept!

[Kev tyler]

Cheers guys

Thanks for the feedback,

Wouldn't it be nice to have the resources to bring something like this to market? I am watching too much dragons den/ shark tank.

Sam I was not suggesting you were old mate, if you were old you would be wise enough to be not  spending  a load of dough on new gear 

Cheers

Kev

[sam.spoons]

OTOH, when I was young I didn't have the cash to spend on new gear (it all went on beer and women) 

[Kev tyler]

Yeagh been there mate

Manufacturers must love us, a tiny tiny improvement ( probably inaudible to the audience  ) and we ditch our kit without a second thought.

I miss the old A B tests of yesteryear, where you didn't have to concentrate so much, when there were huge noticeable differences that prompted upgrade.

Sm58 vs cheap mic, 300 quid speakers vs 1000 quid,  big difference back then in the 80 s, do the same comparison now in a noisey room, not so easy any more, IMHO.

 

[sam.spoons]

I spent a long time researching and auditioning speakers last year (having done the same in Oct 2012 resulting in buying the DL) and changed my 20+ year old Concert Systems passives, I settled on QSC K12s to go with my old but good EV sBa750 sub. A few Yamaha DXR10s and a couple of Alto TS110As for monitor duties (and smaller gigs) completes the rig. It has made a significant improvement in the overall sound, the old rig was very old but very good in it's day, times move on. I've also bought a few new mics (SE H1s and Beta57As) which also help the vocals sound good (I do like condenser mics as a lot of what I do is acoustic based music and the H1s sound more natural than most live vocal mics). Now I've got the X32 as well to cover bigger gigs I'm probably done for a while (well..... except for the S16, or two, Cat5 snake, couple more mic stands and cables etc..... will it never end)

[Kev tyler]

It's a winding road mate isn't it,

I am home in 2 weeks, going to sell every piece of electronics in the house from MP3 players to minindisk and spare mixers and CD players and so on, will treat myself with the cash,

Thinking about yammy dsr15  and ditching my subs and sats, all my current gear is hand made using the beyma specs for their 1000w neo drivers, it sounds nice tbh,  and I have no reason to swap it out, my wages won't change,the audience having no comparator from old to new will not give a damm, we are a funny bunch I think, as you get older You want to manitain sonic quality but I think ease of get in and get out figure highly in the what to buy next equation.


Cheers
Kev

[sam.spoons]

Yup, I've moved a few steps up the ease of get in/out ladder. I'm not a serial gear changer though (simply can't afford to be) I tend to spend a while considering (anoracking) a purchase then I stick with it, usually for a few years. I reckon I've got ten more years (hopefully, I'm 61) doing this and the current rig with very minor tweaks should last me out. Got to save up for a banjo next anyway 

[Keyboard Magic]

Yeagh been there mate

Manufacturers must love us, a tiny tiny improvement ( probably inaudible to the audience  ) and we ditch our kit without a second thought.

I miss the old A B tests of yesteryear, where you didn't have to concentrate so much, when there were huge noticeable differences that prompted upgrade.

Sm58 vs cheap mic, 300 quid speakers vs 1000 quid,  big difference back then in the 80 s, do the same comparison now in a noisey room, not so easy any more, IMHO.

 

I hear you. Sometimes there is no noticeable difference in upgraded gear, sometimes a little, sometimes a lot. It matters that you know there’s an improvement and YOU feel good about it. That sort of makes it alright to blow all that money. And sometimes the audience can hear the difference, especially with new speakers. I was perfectly fine with my existing powered Yorkie E10Ps, but wanted the new PS12Ps for more power for myself (for just in case) Didn’t need ‘em at all but bought them anyway.

They blew me away with the big difference in overall sound reproduction. I felt good. The funny part is, at the first gig with them, I actually got a handful of compliments on how good the speakers sounded. Justifiable Gear Acquisition Syndrome. Case closed. But…. If there’s a cool piece of gear that comes along that really rings my chimes, Stop Me Before I Spend Again. My Financial Advisor (my better half) will reign me in, so to speak.  Hmmmm, need that new matching sub to go with the new tops. 

[Kev tyler]

Both of you guys are spot on, I think we are buying and researching gear and upgrading to keep our own interests alive, I am 51, this is my 30th year in the game, it is nice to sound nice, nobody appreciates that as much as the bloke on stage,, I was hoping to pack in soon, but special delivery of first child Ina few weeks has scuppered that, so I am expecting to be a 70 year old bald bloke doing buble covers in 20 years, I hope they have flying speakers and cars by then,,

 

[Keyboard Magic]

I've been doing a volunteer schtick at a veteran's hospital here in Toronto (Sunnybrook) 21 years to date, playing organ (now a Roland Atelier 800) for the war vets. The music I play is pure oldies. It's one of the gigs that makes me feel young at 59. Some of the regulars come and talk to me after I'm finished. My age has come up and I always say I'm getting old, completely out of energy and I'm almost 60. They laugh and say " Oh my goodness dear, you're so young, I'm 92". Wow, it's all a matter of perspective.

I will keep doing this in particular, even if I have to be wheeled up to the organ and lifted onto the bench in my late 80's  This is one of the many gigs that keeps me feeling young at heart and wanting to keep going. Yes and the gear is getting lighter, but for some reason as I get older, the gear gets heavier too. I'd love for someone to invent gear that packs itself into the van, takes itself out of the van and sets itself up too. 

PS: Kev, you can't go wrong doing Michael Buble' covers, the ladies will go wild. 

[sam.spoons]

I did a gig yesterday, down then back up two flights of stairs (a local pub  on the side of the river Irwell, The Mark Addy) effectively we park on the roof, the worst of both worlds as you're carrying the gear up at the end when you're already knackered  :face palm: Great gig though, part of the English Folk Expo.

I used to windsurf every week, racing various boards over the years and we always noted how much heavier the (sub 13kg) boards were when carrying them back up the beach  I still race and freesail occasionally but have got back into dinghies as well now so, as the weather in the summertime is more suited to skiff type dinghies with huge sails I do more of that these days.

[Keyboard Magic]

I did a gig yesterday, down then back up two flights of stairs (a local pub  on the side of the river Irwell, The Mark Addy) effectively we park on the roof, the word of both worlds as you're carrying the gear up at the end when you're already knackered  :face palm: Great gig though, part of the English Folk Expo.

I used to windsurf every week, racing various boards over the years and we always noted how much heavier the (sub 13kg) boards were when carrying them back up the beach  I still race and freesail occasionally but have got back into dinghies as well now so that takes up part of my sailing time.

I've had the privilege of carrying a Leslie 330 Pro up and down 2 flights of stairs at a big local gig way back in the day. I did it but I was only 25  But the crème de le crème was playing at a major downtown hotel. The ballroom was on the 2nd floor and we were able to drive our van onto a huge freight elevator and back right up to the stage. That was luxury indeed. 

[James91104]

Hmmmmm, cough, cough, as amusing and nostalgic as the veterans of dance hall stories may be, may I suggest we get back to the topic at hand.
Any other considerations in comparison worthy of illumination, albeit still a bit speculative of course ?